Registered: Sep 1999
Location: Texan in Calgary for a while
Posts: 1361

Someone made the suggestion that we have weekly topics in the Discussion area that Marcus or myself bring up. This is a great idea, and I will try to have a new one each Wednesday. After the week is over, I will move the topic from General to the appropriate forum for those that would like to continue the discussion.

To save face from my jumping the gun , this week's topic will be on Bluetooth. What do you think of it? Do you plan on getting the BlueConnect?

I personally think that it's a great idea, although I hate the fact that Bluetooth and wireless conflict with each other. The possibilities for Bluetooth are endless. Send messages to other attendees during meetings or HotSync with your computer while in the office next door. What we need is a NetMeeting-like app for the PalmOS (whiteboard, chat, etc) to make Bluetooth a killer app.

What do you think?

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James Hromadka
VisorCentral.com
Personal Website: http://www.Hromadka.com

Registered: Feb 2000
Location:
Posts: 70

Depending on the power usage, I think that the BlueTooth module will be great for getting the latest versions of forms onto the Visors now carried by all of our IT personell. Imagine being able to send trouble tickets from a dispatcher directly to any IT personell within range right away instead of having to wait for them to sync up to get the notification!

Registered: Mar 2000
Location: nowheresburg, PH
Posts: 98

I'll probably get one in a year or so. It really depends on what "other" bluetooth compatible products are out there. The situation where bluetooth is in right now is just like the LASER, 15 years ago. It is a solution looking for a problem.

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: at work...
Posts: 736

I think that bluetooth has a lot of potential , but there needs to be fine-grained access control to the communication stack. For example, maybe you think it's cool for your visor to automatically hotsync with your PC when you walk into the room, but what if you happened to be looking up some important information for your boss at the time and had to tell him to wait? Or what if you are at a conference and someone keeps sending bluetooth 'spam' advertisements to everyone in the audience? Would you be able to selectively disable communication from individual senders? Developers need to carefully think about the interfaces and how to provide users with enough control to make sure it's usable but not abuse-able.

Just my $0.02

Registered: Mar 2000
Location: McLean, VA USA
Posts: 216

I'll have to agree with the others for now. The possibilities of what could be done with Blue Tooth are endless, what is needed now is some intelligent solutions that use Blue Tooth to prove it's capablilities. I would love to be able to sync to my PC from anywhere in my house or to be able to send appointments, contacts, etc. to my wife's Visor from another room. While we don't use Visors or Palms here at work, I like adfleisher's idea of being able to sync new data to corporate Palm OS servers without being near a cradle. Way cool!

For now, I will wait and see what developes. My plans for Blue Tooth will rest largely on what's available and what it costs.

Craig Hook

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Have Visor Will Travel!

Registered: Jan 2000
Location:
Posts: 27

Well until bluetooth have products being sold, it's vapor hardware. Why support this. Heck, I'm still waiting on the GPS mods and the phone mods.

Marketing is driving this not actual product. We beg for them, but they don't want to produce them. What are we seeing? Free pub, thats all they want. Get their name in the press.

Yes I'm getting tired of the vapor hardware. It's past time to either put up or shutup.

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: richmond, va, usa
Posts: 46

Well, I think that for the investment to be worthwhile, I will need to see enabling devices like a cell phone with modem capabilities available for sale. Motorola has announced several bluetooth products on their site, none of which are what everyone wants: a phone to enable wireless connections.

I can't wait to be able to check my E-mail and ongoing auctions on my Visor without even pulling my phone out of my pocket. I also like the idea of having a wireless hands-free system in my car. I am not saying that the bluetooth-enabled cell phone will be the killer-app for this concept, but it will be enough for me to take the plunge.

Registered: Apr 2000
Location: Madison,AL
Posts: 25

I haven't seen much info about Bluetooth cell phones yet, I wonder what the premium and availability will be on them?

From reading the Bluetooth specification it supports 1 or 2 voice channels in addition to data so if you had a Springboard Bluetooth module with a built in speaker you could have your cellphone in a cradle or belt clip and perhaps TALK on your Visor (using the internal microphone) AND SURF the net at the same time! Cool!

Registered: Mar 2000
Location: nowheresburg, PH
Posts: 98

That gives me an idea Tim. How about a bluetooth enabled eyemodule, with an eye base that can be rotated, the possibility of having a PDA sized video phone is now within grasp. now that my man is cool!

Registered: Nov 1999
Location: bright side of the moon.
Posts: 996

James,

You mention that Bluetooth and Wireless conflict with eachother? Could you elaborate (i'm not to knowledgable in this area)?

I vaguely remember reading that article about Palm's next wave of PDA's using the III and V form factor and one line having wireless capabilities while the other had Bluetooth? Is that why they're not combining the 2 to make a REALLY cool Palm?

Registered: Mar 2000
Location:
Posts: 5

I personally would like to see some kind of hardware address used in Bluetooth to each unit that is tied to each transmission. This way there would be some kind authentication tied to the machine. It would also be nice to use this to filter out someone who is spamming you.

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: Texan in Calgary for a while
Posts: 1361

If I recall correctly, the Wireless Ethernet 802.11(?) uses the same radio frequency as Bluetooth.

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James Hromadka
VisorCentral.com
Personal Website: http://www.Hromadka.com

Registered: Nov 1999
Location: bright side of the moon.
Posts: 996

ahh...wireless ethernet...i thought you meant wireless internet (ala PalmVII) So it's technically feasable to have bluetooth on your palm ALONG with the capabiltiy to surf the web wirelessly with Omnisky or Palm.net??

(my goal: wirelessly get email and surf the web, AND a cradle-less hotsync!)

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: College Station, TX
Posts: 143

My $0.02:

The question is: What can it do today if I buy it today? As far as I can tell, the only current functionality is to beam to another bluetooth equipped Visor, which only gives me a range advantage over the IR.

I went over to the Bluetooth special interest group web page ( http://www.bluetooth.com/ ), where I found exactly two consumer products using Bluetooth - the Springboard isn't even there yet, btw. One is a wireless headset for your cell phone, which would be nice if the Bluetooth Springboard was also a cell phone (but it's not). The other is the piece for your cell phone to be able to use the headset. Oh yeah, and they're vaporware.

So, unless you really want to do wireless beaming, why would you buy the Springboard? Yes, there are a bunch of great potential applications, but I'll buy the springboard when those are actually available. In the meantime, it looks pretty useless to me. There are people in this group who roll their own hardware and software, so maybe they'll have a reason to buy one...In other words, I might buy one when there is a package deal with the Springboard, a PCMIA card for my laptop or card for my desktop, and software drivers. Since I use a Mac, all you Windows types will undoubtedly get to beta test for me first .

Note that this is completely different from buying a Visor based on the hope that Springboards would arrive to make the slot useful - When I bought my Vdx, I knew that I was getting all the functionality of a Palm (OK, so it took a long time to ship to us early adopters).The day it came, I could use the Vdx for useful stuff. I just don't see it for this.

Also, there are going to be some major howls of injustice if/when Widcomm comes out with the next version that can actually do something, and current owners have to make do with software patches or doing without a particular function.

Finally, I'd like for it to be able to synch through my Airport (Apple/Lucent) wireless network...wonder if that's possible...I bought that only when I was sure I could connect both ends of the wireless netword. It's great, btw.

Registered: Mar 2000
Location: NC, Indiana
Posts: 465

I have a few questions for you network people. Is there already a way to integrate Bluetooth into current network infrastructures? Could it be as easy as having hubs/bridges/switches have the capability built in (also imagine the costs of such upgrading)? Or is this not feasible because of BlueTooth range (If I remember correctly--and I may not--it was 1-2 meters?) How does Bluetooth compete with wireless Ethernet? Is Wireless Ethernet more easily integrated into existing networks? Why didn't the creators of Bluetooth recognize wireless Ethernet used the same frequency? Or were they developed at the same time and this happened accidently? I wonder what kind of applications this will have in public places. I remember a friend telling me of a security access card for his work that you didn't have to physical have scanned--it did it wirelessly --so you just held you wallet up near the receiver. The funny quirky here is that one of the readers was low enough to where he could simply point his behind at it and it would grant him access. Imagine the possiblities at a public kiosk of some kind. What a site we could have! .



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-Vinny

"I will eat you like meat" Everclear's Like a California King

Registered: Sep 1999
Location:
Posts: 81

At first I thought that Bluetooth was an awesome idea and I'd get right in there and start writing apps to support it, but if it's going to interfere with an 802.11 network, which I believe will be widely used in the near future, I'm going to have to be hesitent. I realize that both are standards, so they won't just switch frequencies, but what can we do to make these 2 great technologies work together? Do we have to choose or can they coexist??

huski, I'd have to say that your best bet for synching via your wireless ethernet network is to wait a month or 2 (hopefully!) for the Xircom 802.11 wireless Springboard to come out. It supposedly will allow for synching, web surfing, mail gathering, etc through the use of your wireless network. I'm hyped!!!!!

Just my $1.50 worth....I always give more than what's asked for!

[This message has been edited by LuckyChuck (edited 06-14-2000).]

Registered: May 2000
Location: St. Paul, MN
Posts: 1429

I would love to be able to use blue tooth to print, and to type on my stowaway... I could keep stuff in my backpack and still use it. Also the 802.11b standerd uses the excat same frequency, just more power as I understand...

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: College Station, TX
Posts: 143

Looks like I should have checked the Visor cell phone thread - bluetooth phones may be coming by the end of the year

http://www.pcworld.com/pcwtoday/art...0,17052,00.html

Of course, that could be a long time from now...

Is there actually evidence that the Bluetooth will interfere with an 802.11 device, or are people just guessing?

From the Lucent Orinoco page (Orinoco/WaveLAN is what powers the Apple Airport):

quote:

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Spread Spectrum Technology offers several benefits:

Data can be moved quickly.
Transmission is virtually immune to interception.
Transmission is virtually immune to interference.

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Registered: May 2000
Location: Laurel, MD USA
Posts: 26

I have to agree with most everything said here so far.
1)The springboard port is full of promise - and worth waiting to use effectively. (I'm really waiting for a wireless modem and also the GeoDiscovery GPS)
2)Bluetooth sounds wonderful - but until there are other companion products (phones, etc) to use it with it's not worth pursuing. It'd be like buying dvd's before a dvd player is available, just because they're a better technology)
3)Conflict with wireless ethernet is definitely a big downer.

Also, I've got some questions:
1)Have any of you used OmniSky with the visor? If so, how? Are you using one of the "holster" novatel modems that wraps around the palm?
2)LuckyChuck was talking about writing programs for the visor - I've begun to do so using a package called NSBasic/Palm - which isn't bad. But I can see that for truly powerful apps, I'm going to need to go deeper. Would C and Metrowerks codewarrior do the job nicely? What do you visorheads who do app development use?

Sorry if the last couple of points are off topic, James.
--thanks
--Steve Lacher

Registered: Nov 1999
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 10

ok... here we go... !!

a blue tooth TOOTH INSERT microphone.

that's right... put right inside or connected to your tooth.

Then you put a blue tooth speaker in your ear...

what do you have? An invisable cell phone head set.

People will think you are pretty crazy when you are talking to yourself (they already do when I have my headset on).

This is totally doable in a year or so I think.

Any other ideas like this?