Registered: Oct 1999
Location: Rochester, NY, USA
Posts: 61

Ok folks, I've had it. I'm not posting here anymore. Nope, don't have my Visor and will patiently wait for it without getting into a frenzy about what's going on NOW. I talked to a reporter from the NY Times. She told me that the people who wrote Donna D. at Handspring were rather mean. Frankly, I don't want to be a part of a group that can be so hurtful. So, count me out. Its been fun folks, I'll see what anyone has to say to this, and I'll post when I get my visor, but enough is enough. You'll get it when it comes, and it will be cool. If you lack the patience, or need another solution, go elsewhere. I hope we've all learned a lesson here.

PS please don't reply with any "BUT THE DESERVE IT!" or anything starting with the word but. They are doing there best, if that's not good enough, then well, make a decision.

Happy Visoring... Mike

Registered: Oct 1999
Location:
Posts: 187

It really depends on how you define "mean". If she was hurt by people who informed her of the facts, then she needs to get into another line of work. If people were a bit ticked off and ranted and raved a bit - ditto. Remember that "the customer is always right", and that extends to the right of the customer to express dissatisfaction, even to the highest level.
On the other hand, if people wrote with threats, or personal attacks - THAT would be uncalled for!
The point that I am trying to make is that we need WAY more information than that people were "mean" to her. If "mean" is defined as angry with the way that they have been treated, then so be it. If "mean" is defined as unwarranted personal attacks, then shame on them!

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: Rochester, NY, USA
Posts: 61

It was implied that a few comments were "personal attacks" I still think it was uncalled for. I don't think its POSSIBLE for Donna NOT to know what's going on... I see people's point (ordered sep 14, no visor yet) but that was shocking... I'm in NO WAY saying every person was attacking mind you.

Registered: Oct 1999
Location:
Posts: 121

I sent her a nice letter a week ago trying to explain that ignoring customers was about to set off a firestorm, and she sent me a nice "don't worry, be happy" letter in reply. Unfortunately when I needed help with my particular 9/14 order I sent her another letter as she suggested and it went into the black hole that is Handspring.

She had my phone, fax, e-mail to forward to whomever she chose. No contact in a week.

Unfortunately she and Jeff set this company up for sales to feed off the hype of their personas. I'm not surprised that a *few* true belivers that were pulled into the "Cult of Handspring" are taking it personally when the leaders abuse the faithful.

Her trying to discredit her customers just because she got a few angry letters is pathetic. Hopefully the NYT reporter sees that.

P.S.

Isn't it funny to see how it takes a real news organization to get on the story. It shows you how many in the Silicon Valley sycophant "press" like Upside.com, The Industry Standard, Wired, etc. have been pulled into the personality and VC money game and can't offend friends by printing the truth.



[This message has been edited by reganc (edited 10-28-1999).]

Registered: Oct 1999
Location:
Posts: 187

I think that if only a few could be classified as personal attacks, that isn't TOO bad, all things considered. ANY personal attacks are uncalled for, but she's dealing with the public here...Do you think that Bill Gates has had only a "few" personal attacks? Jeez, I think that he got more than just a "few" from Jobs! One thing to consider in management is that you cannot classify "personal" attacks as personal. The people don't know you personally, so they can't attack you personally. What they are attacking is what you represent. In her case, she represents, at the highest level, a company that has lied to customers (even if by proxy through their outsource companies), and given the perception that they say a lot of nice things, but do little to nothing about the problems.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not defending these people. I'm just telling you something that you already know - this 'aint a perfect world! What do great leaders do when they are "personally" attacked? They demonstrate by their actions that the attackers were uninformed boobs! Actions speak louder than words. Don't get upset - get moving!
...I'll step off of my soap box now...

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: Rochester, NY, USA
Posts: 61

reganc: I've heard enough outta you... cancel your order or suck it up.


staad: I agree, but come on, even if people do attack, its STILL not called for on a PERSONAL level. I agree on the rest. I've corresponded with Allen at Handspring and I've found his word to be true, he has stated that they are wrong and they are working on the issues. There are MANY issues and they will take TIME to work out. All I'm saying is, I'm fed up with getting stupidly enraged at someone who is obviously trying their best. The web page is up, I think that shows theay ARE doing something.

Ok, have a good day.

-Mike

Registered: Oct 1999
Location:
Posts: 187

I said that personal attacks are uncalled for, but in the real world they happen. Welcome to providing a product or service to the general public.

I would hope that this is not their "best". They are following convention, which in this case is no where near "best". Drastic problems cropped up. Things happen. They are not taking drastic measures (IMHO). But, when you run a company, you get to make the big decisions, and your company lives or dies by them.

I have heard nothing really drastic happening. They put the web page back up. So what! They needed to do that anyway! They added more people to the phone bank. Big Deal! They needed to do that anyway!

Why not send a warm body to the call center who has the authority to get all of the early orders directly to another warm body in the warehouse? Then when the pre-orders are located, they can talk to each other and make sure they go directly onto a truck for overnight delivery? What a concept! What solution have they used instead? "We'll mark your order 'priority'". "Thank you, Mam, and when does that mean that I can expect my Visor? Tomorrow?". "Oh, no. In a couple of weeks, probably. We can't get your order out any faster, we are only authorized to mark it 'priority'".

Wouldn't it be great PR to be able to talk to someone with the authority to do something AND have the answers to your questions? THAT is customer service.

Again, actions speak louder than words. Why should they get upset about words. Words do nothing. They have demonstrated that fact. Do something different. Do something enexpected. Go the extra mile. Make customers happy! Even if you don't like doing it! That's what builds a great business.

[This message has been edited by staad (edited 10-28-1999).]

[This message has been edited by staad (edited 10-28-1999).]

Registered: Oct 1999
Location:
Posts: 121

Mike, you sound like a Handspring employee! Are you interviewing for a job? You passed the test, but should try applying through the website. Oh by the way, in case you haven't been paying attention, cancelling hasn't been an option.

It seems today they're offering people the ability to cancel, but that's another promise we'll just have to see about, huh? Where did the other requests entered into that form go?

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: Montgomery, AL, USA
Posts: 17

mike,

I agree with you that it seems like the folks at Handspring are trying hard to make everything right with the folks they have messed up things with. I think this is a good thing, but was there anything else they could do without going belly up soon? I am still pretty upset with the way my order degenerated into a nightmare. My phone bill next week will be quite a reminder of what I went through.

Jeff and Donna are about to make a whole pile of money off this new product. It is an exciting addition to the palmtop market. Having to take the heat for mistakes is one of the things that goes along with the opportunity to make all that money. I don't feel one bit sorry for them or their Customer Service department having to endure piles of calls to fix mistakes they have made.

I did not send either one of them a personal email the other day, but I think that the flood probably was nothing more than a minor event in their day. I can understand some folks being mean. Try talking to me in person when you are holding a few hundred dollars of my money without my permiassion. I can assure you that please and thank you will not be part of my vocabulary.

I think it is great that you still stand behind the company, but trying to silence detractors is not the way to go about it. The "I've had enough out of you" comment in a forum designed to discuss both good and bad experiences with Handspring orders is ridiculous. What are you going to do if they don't comply with your decree? bombard people that dont listen to you with electrons from their monitors? This forum will be a lot more informative if we don't go out and attack folks that we disagree with.

I, for one, will gripe and moan about my problems here whenever I feel it necessary. I find it somewhat therapeutic to publicly air my anxieties whilst awaiting the delivery of my VDx sometime in the hopefully not too distant future.

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: Temperance MI, USA
Posts: 28

Canceling is now an option. I thought the letter Written By Handspring explaining the problems was very well done.

IMHO they have answered all of my questions and have completely restored my confidence in them. I must admit that I was getting a little cynical.

It takes a big company to say that they are sorry. Please read the explaintion of the shipping problems in it's entirety.

Way to go Handspring! Your every faithfull and loyal follower.

Eric!

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: Rochester, NY, USA
Posts: 61

I never said don't post, or stop posting, I said I didn't need any replies from him on this string. BTW, does posting here REALLY make the time go faster for you guys or what? I found it didn't, in fack it made time stand still.

Later all, hope there are no hard feelings.

reganc: lol ! _yeah_ I'm their new PR guy. Trying to break all you people from inside! HAHAHAA...

[This message has been edited by Mike (edited 10-28-1999).]

[This message has been edited by Mike (edited 10-28-1999).]

Registered: Oct 1999
Location:
Posts: 187

boulder,
I think that they outlined the problems very well. I think that their solution leaves a lot to be desired, especially in the area of pre-orders that currently stand unfilled. "We promised you FIFO, but we'll get it to you whenever." SHOULD be "We promised you FIFO, so we'll ship it out next day air as soon as we find out that we didn't ship when we should have."

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: Rochester, NY, USA
Posts: 61

Staad, I Heard from a source "lets call him Allen" that there is a pile (*large*) of orders from September that are being worked on and will be resolved asap. Will people who ordered now get their before some of those... probably, but that's the way it is. Unless we get a Highly specialized team together to break-into HS, steal the pile and work through it ourselves. That or fire-bomb the place (when no-one's there of course.)

Registered: Oct 1999
Location:
Posts: 187

Mike,
Nobody better touch the HS building! Who would answer our emails if that happened? Seriously, violence is not the answer.

Is "Allen" making sure that these boxes get onto the truck BEFORE any other orders go out???? Is "Allen" shipping these boxes out next day, instead of ground????? If "Allen" isn't empowered to do at least ONE of these things then there isn't a whole lot that's being done. They need to work on the missed orders anyway. Working on them and getting them into the hands of slighted customers are two different animals!

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: Rochester, NY, USA
Posts: 61

Ahem, note the I'm not a terrorist jeesh.
Anyway, I don't know, I woulnd't assume so based on past experience. It would be NICE... ahem anyone from HS reading if they shipped those late(or messed-up) orders quicker than ground.

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: Thousand Oaks, CA, USA
Posts: 49

Oh, goodie, another place to chime in.

I hate to say this, but the only type of so-called "attack" that Ms. Dubinsky's behaviour doesn't warrant are the ones on her health. Anyone threatening her person is way out of line (and deserves to be prosecuted for it).

Pretty much everything else can be explained away as pent-up frustration that she has, intentionally or unintentionally, courted by not being more forthright in her communications with that part of the "Visor Community" that have had order fulfillment problems.

Even the latest 'explanation' leaves me cold. The following came from their website:

"Order status: We realize that many of you are frustrated that we are unable to give you exact order status, and details as to when your unit will ship. If you ordered over the phone, you will be unable to check your order status on our web site. All orders received in September are being considered the highest priority for us to ship. We expect to have all orders shipped no later than mid-November (and hopefully much sooner). We realize that we will have exceeded the 4-6 week guideline and possibly go out as late as 8 weeks for delivery of those initial orders."

This paragraph, other than the admission that there were problems with some of the orders, makes very little sense to me --> fixing our orders are of the "highest priority" yet people who are still ordering well after us will receive their orders way before us.

How can that be true? If we really are their "highest priority", our orders would be at the front of the que rather than just placed back in line after the problems with the order are corrected (I was told it would be another 2-4 weeks to receive my order after fixing their error on it).

This still feels to me like a non-apology apology --> they don't deny there were problems, but they haven't taken full responsibility for them. Nor have they taken nearly enough steps for them to state that we are their "highest priority".

I'd like to hear some detail about the specific "mean"-ness that Ms. Dubinsky has experienced in her inbox.....her story to the NYT reporter might just be a quaint way of attempting to diffuse the story on this start-up fiasco.

[This message has been edited by KGrate (edited 10-28-1999).]

Registered: Oct 1999
Location:
Posts: 187

I'm glad that the CEO's letter didn't just hit me wrong. November 8th would be 8 weeks for first day people. If they ship ground, it means that ALL of the first days orders would have to be on the truck by this Monday. So the Mid-November date for the orders "going out" could push the delivery dates into 10+ weeks! How special!
You are correct that this, in no way, proves to me that my problem has any "priority" to them. Solve the problem and then move on. Don't try to solve the problem as you try to keep moving. What is it that you tell the boss when you haven't done a thing on the project that is due? "We're working on it!"
I'm sure glad that HS is "working" on the problem. I hope that they post the answer when they find it...

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: Rochester, NY, USA
Posts: 61

Actually, it makes SENSE to me that we arent' at the head of that que. The que that is in place for new orders probably does not include us becasue (for fault of HS), there is something wrong with our orders. If I ordered today, I wonder if I would get the new order before the old. I picture it this way. New orders are being entered into their new computer system, with web-tracking and all. The *Special* cases are being taken care of by hand since that's the way they were handled to begin with. This makes better sense since if you change your order, you go into the new system at the end of the que.

Other than that, the reporter mentioned it to me as a side note. It wasn't information she HAD to give me and I'm beginning to regret I even mentioned it. I guess I just wanted people to realize that YES, as CEO, she IS responsible for everything, just as you would blame Clinton for a problem in our country. My point is that I felt bad that people had to contact her at all, and when they did, they were "mean" OK?

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: Temperance MI, USA
Posts: 28

Hey I have an idea. Lets all just order another Visor now and see what order we get first. Then just cancel or refuse shipment on the second one that gets there.

Just kidding but it is tempting I must admit!

Registered: Oct 1999
Location:
Posts: 187

If she is the head of a company and uses (I assume) a VERY obvious email address, she should EXPECT to get contacted! If she want's to cut herself off the email from the "outside world" (which may, or may not be a good thing) then she needs to drop the conventional email address! Maybe that was just an oversight on the part of the IS people when they set up their site. Oh, well.
As for using an exception handling for our orders, I'm all for it - if it works! It has proven itself to be flawed time and time again. When a CSR supervisor tells me that if they reenter the information that it will take 2-4 weeks to get my order, that is NOT special handling. If they tell me that they will personally see to it that it is in stock and will ship out TODAY - THAT is special handling!