Registered: Sep 1999
Location: CA,CA,CA
Posts: 21

Hi, i'm looking into a PDA. I'm interested in either the Palm III or the Visor with 2mb of RAM (due to price restrictions...both are around $170).

However, i'm not sure which one is better to get. I realize that the Visor has the improved screen, and the springboard....however its not flash upgradeable! Is this crazy or what? On the other hand, the Palm III is flash upgradeable.

That means if i buy the Visor i can't upgrade the OS. Also, i'm not really interested in the springboard. So does the improved screen out-weigh the non-flash upgradeability of the visor?

Thanks in advance.

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 33

You can purchase an 8 meg flash module from Handspring for $79. It's not an upgrade but hey how much memory do you need? I mean with 8 meg you can store hundreds of applications.
Regarding the display, pencomputing.com advises tht the Visor display quality is comparable to the Palm V, but at half the price.
Finally, don't dismiss the Springboard module. Do you know what modules are coming out? Don't be surprised if there ends up being one available that you find interesting. At least with the Visor you'll have the choice. With Palm what choice do you have? It's an organizer period. The Visor will be a phone, pager, MP3 player, digital camera, GPS module, universal remote control and voice recorder. Sorry it won't take the garbage out or wash your windows, but hey for a couple of hundred dollars, it offers more bang for the buck than a Palm

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: CA,CA,CA
Posts: 21

HappyBoy, Thanks for help. However, i was referring to the upgradeability of the OS. The current OS version is 3.x while the 4.x version is due out soon. I would like to be able to upgrade the OS if a new version comes out...however, w/o the flash capabilities i will be unable to do so.

However, i do agree that the display and springboard are well worth it...so i plan on ordering it...probably the 2mb version. Thanks for the help.

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 33

XGen, sorry I misunderstood your message. I guess the question to ask is, what will v. 4 do that 3.1 doesn't do? I think sometimes that software is upgraded just to keep people employed. 3.1 seems ok to me. Keep in mind that Palm has agreed to co-operative with Handspring, or why else did they allow Handspring to use the Palm OS in the first place? So maybe Handspring will find a way to accomodate OS upgrades.

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: Burlington, VT, USA
Posts: 127

Do we know for sure that the Visor doesn't have its OS in Flash memory? I didn't see that on the Handspring site...

Registered: Sep 1999
Location:
Posts: 5

I had the same concern regarding not being able to upgrade the OS on the Visor. However, someone reminded me that the last few OS upgrades that Palm Computing did were done with applications runing in RAM instead of flash upgrades. I think one needent assume that the OS that you begin with will be the one you always have!

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: CA,CA,CA
Posts: 21

Well, according to the Handspring employee that i talked to who was taking phone orders, the Visor is not flash upgradeable. Although this is not of critical importance, it is nice to have. Even moreso due to the fact that OS 4.x is due out relatively soon. I still plan on buying a Visor standard; not the deluxe. While its nice to have the extra RAM, i don't think its worth spending so much money on the first product that a company comes out with.

Nevertheless, it is dissapointing that this product is not flash-upgradeable. Hopefully in the future, Handspring will get it right. For now though, the improved display and the addition of the springboard make it a worthwhile purchase.

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: Beavercreek, OH 45434
Posts: 29

Boy, that is depressing to find out that the Visor is not flash upgradeable. I just ordered mine on Friday but I had no idea that this Handspring would make such an error. It's likely that someday in the near future Palm will have to add additional functionality to the OS (like support for larger memory sizes). This is a bummer...

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 74

I wonder about the flash upgradability. The III has upgradable flash, but 3.1 requires the DrangonBall EZ which the III does not have. Having an upgradable chip does not mean that the new OS will support it.

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: Streamwood, IL USA
Posts: 118

Also remember that until the Palm III came out it was not flash upgradeable. You had to replace the memory chip inside the unit (which was about as complicated as upgrading a DIMM on a laptop.) And since the III has come out there has been nothing to upgrade to. The only use would be TRG's flashpro, losing that is gonna suck!

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: St. Louis, MO, USA
Posts: 8

Maybe I am missing something. The Palm was not flash upgradeable before the Palm III? I have a PalmPro (gasp!) and I know I upgraded the OS to 2.0.5 from whatever was originally on it. If I look at the list of applications listed in memory, I see one called Update 2.0.5. I installed it like any other app. If the Pro was not flash upgradeable, whatever that means, could not the Handspring OS be upgraded in a similar manner?

Registered: Sep 1999
Location:
Posts: 81

I see that there's some confusion about PalmOS upgrades to Visors. *If* I understand the situation, it's like this:

Reportedly, the PalmOS for Visor is -- as with all Palms prior to III -- in ROM. (Presumably this info comes from the developers info ... I haven't confirmed it.) That makes it impossible or at least impractical to do a major system upgrade, say from 3.x to 4.x. *BUT* ...

1) *Patches* and minor upgrades can still be done, as with earlier Palms, by installing the patch as if one was intalling a software app. So if Visors ship with PalmOS 3.1 (?), it *may* be possible to install a patch to upgrade it to the ever-rumored PalmOS 3.3.

2) Major PalmOS system upgrades are mostly, I think, to deal with new hardware. So even if one *could* upgrade Visor to PalmOS 4.x when it arrives, there might not be much point to it. To get the most out of PalmOS 4.x, one will probably have to buy a next-gen Palm or Visor.

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: Spokane, WA, USA
Posts: 114

First of all, I don't think Handspring necessarily made an "Error" by not using FlashROM for the OS.

From my understanding, their primary target population was Joe and Jane Consumer, not Bill and Beth Power-User. Does the Visor provide substantial functionality at a very reasonable price? YES! Look at the screen, look at the memory, look at the Springboard technology and look at what would considered by some as "non-professional" colors.

Both Joe and Jane Consumer can get into the digital PDA market without paying an arm and a leg, but still have the tried-and-true PalmOS and all it's 3rd-party web-wide support. In fact, it should be noted again that the Visor Solo is an EXCELLENT idea! Wife buys a Visor Deluxe. Husband gets jealous (or vice-versa). Husband doesn't need another cradle, just the machine. Visor Solo saves him $30 bucks.

Joe and Jane also probably aren't incredibly concerned about OS 3.1 versus OS 4.0. If they are, it's because people around here are screaming that the sky is falling.

It almost seems as if people here think that if OS 4.0 comes out that their Visors or their Palms will be totally worthless. Wrong. They'll continue to work just as fine as they did before. Maybe the "old" ones won't support color? Oh no! It doesn't have a color screen anyway!

Can OS 3.1 be patched? Yes, so you're off the hook with the "what if the OS has bugs?" excuse.

To the one asking about Palm III or Visor Standard, I say: Visor Standard. Get the USB support (lightning fast HotSync's), get the killer screen (even better than IIIx (and probably IIIe)), get a cool color (ice or blue, maybe), and don't worry about massive upgrades in the OS. (If the OS upgrades are too big, sell your machine later and pick up a new one, or see if the company will swap out the ROM chip for you.)