Registered: Jan 2001
Location: Sayre, PA
Posts: 39

ebooks cost too much form a public library?

I was wondering if anyone out there is buying their ebooks on a consistent basis. I feel that publishers have priced ebooks out of the range of most consumers and have set the system up to fail. Yesterdays NY Times has an interesting article on publishing that points to a slow down in book sales because publishers have priced books too high for most consumers.

NYTimes Article

Publishers argue that they are just covering costs but it seems an argument without merit when books cost $2.00 to create sell for $22.00+. The article also states that publishers use little consistency when pricing books. Something I definitely find when shopping for ebooks. Because of the high price of ebooks I rarely buy them and usually take out anything I want from the public library. I am actually one of those crazy people who prefer ebooks to real books because of the convenience, however, I would prefer to stay at home and download a book then go out to the library. Guttenberg has created an excellent library for books without copyright holders.

Anybody think it is possible to start an ebook public library. Instead of having to return the book it becomes unreadable on your palm after 2 weeks. You only borrow the book just like the library. Lots of legal hurdles I know, any other reason this idea would not work?

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Last edited by rnunnink on 12-17-2001 at 08:22 PM

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Here's a "don't have to register" link to the same article (only up until 12/22/01, though)

Incidentally, the cost of actually printing a book may be rather low, but the publisher has to take into account the costs of transporting books to resellers, of the people who worked on the book (editors, designers, etc), and the royalties to be paid to the author. Ditto for CDs. The unit cost to the consumer has a lot more to it than simple manufacturing costs.

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my local public library rents rocketbooks and books to read on them. i have asked them about carrying books for the palm os. they are checking into it.

their site is www.tpl.toronto.on.ca

mc

Registered: Jan 2000
Location: Twin Cities, MN
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I imagine the biggest hurdle for libraries to overcome in renting ebooks is simply the technological infrastructure they'd need to develop it. Libraries get little funding as it is and the publishers certainly have little reason to support libraries.

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Registered: Jan 2001
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quote:

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Incidentally, the cost of actually printing a book may be rather low, but the publisher has to take into account the costs of transporting books to resellers, of the people who worked on the book (editors, designers, etc), and the royalties to be paid to the author

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Registered: Jan 2000
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quote:

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unfortunately they are sort of going bankrupt

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Well, that's my point.

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No Random House or Simon and Shyster here.

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Right. Libraries servce no purpose for large publishers. I can see smaller publishers using them as one means of promotion/marketing, but even that is a weak argument.

Electronic books are also problematic in that libraries can't even generate revenue from them in the one single way that they can with physical media: late fees.

I think the best model for e-books would be something like audible.com. You pay for a service that then gives you access to a library of titles. That would be tricky to deal with that type of solutoin with the major publishers however, as I doubt that they would provide overall rights for that.

That said, I guess a company could legitimately purchase x number of ebook licenses and then loan them to x number of people (possibly for a fee) at a time. There would have to be a lot of documentation and such to make sure the company isn't ever 'lending' more books than they own at a time, of course.

Regardless, it still needs to be a money-generating model...something libraries aren't necessarily able to accept.

I DO agree with your assesment that a lot of media companies are arbitrarily pricing electronic versions of their content. They do not get the fact that people DO want etexts and MP3s and they do NOT want to pay for the media. Ultimately, these publishing companies will eventually have to succumb to that and offer lower-priced content in a digital-only medium. I would start purchasing mp3 IMMEDIATELY if the price were in line with what you were getting. I believe the only pay-for-mp3 experiments were done with the mp3s costing the same amount as the physical media. A dumb experiment, IMHO. It seems as if the publishers are making the same exact mistake with their ebooks.

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quote:

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Originally posted by homer


Right. Libraries servce no purpose for large publishers. I can see smaller publishers using them as one means of promotion/marketing, but even that is a weak argument.

Electronic books are also problematic in that libraries can't even generate revenue from them in the one single way that they can with physical media: late fees.

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Last edited by mensachicken on 12-18-2001 at 06:37 AM

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First off, libraries pay a prime fee for the books they stock. Considerably more than the cover price of the book. They pay a special, inflated rate to account for the fact that the book will have a larger audience.

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Originally posted by rnunnink
Hey you sound like a publisher
I've worked in publishing. Ya learn stuff. Especially during the paper shortage a few years ago when all the book prices shot up.
I also know someone who's self-publishing her book.

and thanks for fixing my link.
just an alternate, really ...

That argument still doesn't hold water.
You've never gotten a book wet, I gather ...

Publishers and record companies have always claimed they didn't make money when we know for sure it is authors and musicians who get he shaft
some do, some don't. The writers with a very comfortable lifestyle -- such as Stephen King or Michael Chrichton -- aren't very common. (of course, in those cases, the consumer is also paying for a brand name, because the publisher has to pay these authors a bundle to get 'em under their umbrella.) profit margins are low for publishers, as noted in the article.


Originally posted by homer
What do they do when they receive donated books from collections? Obviously those aren't paid for. (Maybe they don't take donated books?)
The two libraries I frequent generally add all donated books (and other items) to their booksales. One has a big sale weekend three times a year; the other actually has a space for a small bookstore, operated by the Friends of the Library (volunteers).

My point was that libraries don't generate revenue except from card fees and late fees.
Public libraries generally don't have actual revenue streams. They receive a small amount from local taxes, a small amount (though larger than taxes) from the state, and a small amount from booksales as noted. The majority of the rest comes from donations and patrons. One of the two libraries I go to has bookplates in some books noting, "purchased with the assistance of" and an organization, county or person's name. That library is primarily funded by the two counties it services, and though the newspapers and people in the area always say how much the library is needed, how important it is, its budget never gets passed the first time through and there isn't much support for the expansion they need to be able to continue.

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I have no problem with the writers and publishers getting their fair share of profits. What I don't understand is if they can sell a paperback for $6 and everyone make a profit (including the store, why can't the publisher sell an e-book, which has very little additional cost, for $3.

I worked in retail for many years at different kinds of stores and realize that the mark-up varies depending on the type of store it is. But most hard goods seem to have a 100% (more or less) mark up. This allows them to pay for the space, employees, ect.

If we are not paying for all of this, why does an e-book cost about the same as a paperback?

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Howard

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I agree...

I would bet that there are no books these days that AREN'T in digital format at some point before being printed. How hard is it to take that text and distill it into ebook format. I sincerely doubt that there would be too much additional cost in creating the ebook.

Note that I have never had an ebook and don't really want to have any. I much prefer reading a "real" paper book.

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Originally posted by creole
I would bet that there are no books these days that AREN'T in digital format at some point before being printed. How hard is it to take that text and distill it into ebook format. I sincerely doubt that there would be too much additional cost in creating the ebook.

Note that I have never had an ebook and don't really want to have any. I much prefer reading a "real" paper book.

I agree with everything you said.
I have a couple of reference documents on my VDx but that's all they're there for -- reference. staring at a screen to read for an extended period ain't my idea of a good time. (besides, what if you drop it in the pool?)

I think the biggest stumbling block to ebooks is a universal reader, and ensuring copyright protection. It's much easier to duplicate a computer file than a hard copy book.

In the early-1990's I read Ben Bova's novel "CyberBooks," which postulated a revolution in publishing when an inventor created a handheld computer-like device which could contain the text of a book in a format sized like a book, yet less expensive than books were then being published for (it took place in a near-future where inflation went out of control). Several people were murdered over the invention and by the end the publishing industry has been demolished by this book reading "toy." I wonder if some in the industry have given thought to this novel (or any other that might have been similar which I'm not aware of) and want to try to avoid such an outcome.

Most books and magazine articles are sent to the publisher in a manuscript format either as hard-copy or electronic documents, and if accepted generally has to be submitted as an electronic document anyway. They'll be sent to the printer in a format that can be directly sent to press, or if absolutely necessary in a "camera-ready" format (a printout that looks exactly how they want to appear in the final). In the movie "The Paper" there's a scene with Ron Howard's younger brother where he's recompositioning the front page prior to it being sent to press, which would give you an idea.

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Last edited by Yorick on 12-18-2001 at 09:35 PM

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Speaking as a librarian (although I'm not in acquisitions), I'd lie to correct mensachicken. Libraries pay essentially retail for most books they buy; it's sometimes cheaper due to volume discounts from vendors. It's a different story for periodicals. Libraries must often pay an "institutional" subscription rate which is much more expensive than rates for individual subscribers. Prices particularly for academic journals, especially scientific ones, have been skyrocketing, and is a major problem for libraries.

This is true in the United States at least. I've heard that there are schemes in other countries to compensate publishers for the use of their books in libraries.

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Having commented on the small profit margins of books and CDs earlier in this thread, I have to say, that after reading this article I have to change my stance.
Three to four dollars per unit for the music companies! holy crow!

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quote:

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Originally posted by Yorick
Having commented on the small profit margins of books and CDs earlier in this thread, I have to say, that after reading this article I have to change my stance.
Three to four dollars per unit for the music companies! holy crow!

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Originally posted by Toby
Not every recording artist is a Garth Brooks.

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They only make that on units sold. If an album doesn't sell enough to make enough money to recoup the record company's advance, then they've effectively lost money.

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Originally posted by homer
From what I understand, they rarely LOOSE money. They may break even, but not usually loose (UNLESS, it's a BIG artist that fails mid-step in their career).

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