Registered: Dec 1999
Location: Durham, NC
Posts: 78

So I've used my new Visor for about a week now. Thing is covered with scratches. Didn't realize what I was doing to it at first. This is my first handheld device. I've tracked down the source of the scratches to a nub of plastic on the stylus that came with the device. The nub seems to be a manufacturing defect as it's directly in line with the mold seam at the tip of the stylus. What's up with that? Is it just normal for these handhelds to get scratched up? Is there a way to polish out the scratches? Should I return the thing? Is this covered under warranty? What's the scoop here? Thnx.

Registered: Dec 1999
Location: Chandler, AZ
Posts: 289

Handspring decided to include a crappy stylus with the Visor.. thats the bottom line. Like many people on this board, I got some screen protection (WriteRights) along with a new stylus (Pilot Pentopia) and have the supplied stylus for emergencies only (even with the screen protection I am scared to use it..)

Personally I feel it is unacceptable of Handspring to supply such a lousy stylus with the Visor and hope they change this before too many more screens get scratched all up.

Joe

Registered: Oct 1999
Location:
Posts: 121

This "feature" is a defective stylus that comes with all Visors and is covered under the standard consumer warranty. If Handspring tries to argue otherwise they'll be fighting a losing battle against thousands of users that can testify to the same problem -- identified where? -- not Handspring's website silly, but Visor Central.

The solution is to file down the defective hard plastic ridge (before using it of course)

Registered: Dec 1999
Location: Durham, NC
Posts: 78

Sheesh, I feel a little silly for even posting. Should've read thru these forums a little first....

Things I've learned after an hour of browsing:

1) The stylus shipped (a/k/a the POS Stylus) is well... a POS.

2) I need to go invest in a can of turtle wax and try to recover my screen. I use the shut-off gesture a lot which is to draw from the grafitti area up into the main screen area. I have 3 nice parallel scractches running vertically up and down 3/4 of my visor. Plus multiple small scratches in the grafitti area. I'm bummed.

3) I may want to invest in some WriteRight (sp?) sheets. Best place to get them seems to be outpost.com (free shipping). That's my fave site anyway for buying computer stuff on line.

4) I definitely want to replace my stylus. Best one out there seems to be PDAPanache.com's nailhead stylus. I don't paticularly like the orange tip (what is this a construction zone?), but I guess I'll get over it.

<sigh> Damn Turtlewax had better work or this thing is going to get returned.



[This message has been edited by robertl1 (edited 01-01-2000).]

Registered: Dec 1999
Location: Durham, NC
Posts: 78

Stunning new news. I got an email from someone at Handspring that had seen my note up here about scratches on screen. He is sending me a pack of deluxe styli and offered to swap out the Visor if the screen is very badly scratched. I'm taking him up on that offer.

I know a lot of people here are saying customer support at HandSpring sucks. But as far as my experience goes... it's pretty awsome support. OK, they sent out a piece of plastic with a nub on it. Bummer. But they sure are bending over backwards to make it right. I tend to not judge companies by their problems but how they FIX their problems.


[This message has been edited by robertl1 (edited 01-11-2000).]

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: Simi Valley, CA
Posts: 110

What did they think of your "famous microwave treatment" comment?

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Joe V. - Simi Valley, CA

Registered: Dec 1999
Location:
Posts: 9

I just ordered the PDA Panache replacement stylus (chrome - I think it'll look cool with my Ice VDX)

I rather like the orange safety tip - especially on the "Duo"-type combo pen/styli. Knowing me, if I had one of those I'd be terrified that I'd start to write on the screen with the pen tip by mistake. Seems to me that the orange tip would help keep them straight.

I haven't had major scratching on my Visor yet from the stock stylus, though there definitely is some minor scratching - the thing I hate most about the stock stylus is the light weight. Makes it hard to make my Graffiti characters register. I'm looking forward to using the PDA Panache.

Registered: Nov 1999
Location:
Posts: 9

I noticed a small scratchy feeling as I was using the stylus during the first hour; I had put five or six small scratches in the Grafitti area. Running the point over my fingertip, I could feel some tiny roughness. I noted the artifacts from the mold, but I wondered why that would scratch the screen -- wouldn't it be like trying to scratch a sheet of diamond with a piece of sharp glass? It's not only the sharpness of the point but the hardness compared to the material that counts. A quick look under a microscope showed several grains of sand or grit imbedded in the plastic point. I surmise that somebody spilled some grit into the plastic stock at the stylus factory? I called Handspring; the man on the phone said they would replace the stylus, did I want a new Visor? I said I would hesitate to forego the use of it (for another eight weeks shipping there plus eight weeks shipping back)... he transferred me to another dept. and I waited on hold for 30 minutes. Finally I gave up and tried email. I offered to send them back the stylus if they wanted to check their manufacturing process, and I could change out the screen if they'd send me a new one. So far, not even an acknowledgement of the email, been a good week. I'll probably send the email again tomorrow, I assume they're just buried because of the Christmas rush.
Wood [email protected]

Registered: Dec 1999
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 114

I think if you said you'd like a new visor you will get it in a much shorter time and you need not return the old one until you receive the replacement.

Registered: Dec 1999
Location: Durham, NC
Posts: 78

They are swapping out my Visor screen now. They're sending direct and I'll send the old screen back after the replacement. They want me to beta test a new enduser procedure for doing screen replacements. I've been dealing with someone at Handspring management. They are very aware of this issue.

More info on the thread: [email protected]. This is a mail drop they've setup to deal with this issue.

Registered: Nov 1999
Location: Washington DC
Posts: 6

I just got my visor three days after X-mas and it's still got a crappy scratching stylus. The "stylus problem" isn't only on "a few early units", and it hasn't been "fixed" at all. My nicked-up screen is evidence of that.

Plainly put, this is a product defect and I believe that I'm entitled to a recall of the stylus at the very least. The only thing Handspring can do to alleviate the problem of this defective stylus is to ship screen protectors with all their units, which is something they should have been doing all along.

Peeved in DC

Registered: Nov 1999
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 434

Checked out a Palm IIIe stylus, Visor cheapie graphite x 2, and Visor coloured ones x 4.

In my humble opinion and in my batch, the Visor cheapie ones were the "best". The Visor coloured ones had huge ridges, and the cheapie plastic ones had only a tiny, barely noticeable ridge. The Palm IIIe had a small ridge, in between in size.

Anyway, my graffiti area has slight scratches on it, but the rest of the screen do not. I'm gonna get some WriteRights, but there's no way I'm paying US$36 to get them shipped up to Canada. I'll get it somewhere else like www.outpost.com or something. Or maybe that $4.50 Hong Kong version will be available somewhere.

Registered: Dec 1999
Location: Durham, NC
Posts: 78

Got my new screen today. Don't have a screwdriver small enuf to do the swap. Will take to work tomorrow. They're having me beta test a new enduser screen swap procedure. I'll document how it goes and try to get a report up here. It does look a little tricky. Wish me luck...

They sent me a 5 pack of styli to make up for the troubles. They're unusable. Nubs all over them that scratch screen. I'm gonna send em back. Useless pieces of plastic crap. They need an Inspector #9 to check these things before they go out the door.

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: Baltimore MD, USA
Posts: 717

quote:

---

Originally posted by robertl1:
Got my new screen today. Don't have a screwdriver small enuf to do the swap.
---snip----
They sent me a 5 pack of styli to make up for the troubles. They're unusable. Nubs all over them that scratch screen. I'm gonna send em back.

---

Registered: Dec 1999
Location: Durham, NC
Posts: 78

Good thought. I forgot there was a screwdriver in there. No matter. I had tools at work and successfully replaced my screen. It was actually kinda fun. A little tricky in places so I'm not sure they're gonna roll this out to the masses. But it worked great for me. I now have a scratch-free Visor with a PDAPanache stylus and a stack of WriteRights. Bliss.

Registered: Nov 1999
Location:
Posts: 145

I'm a Visor user living in Germany. I e-mailed Mrs. Dubinsky and received a prompt e-mail response the same day. I was very happy that in addressing the Handspring CEO one receives not only a polite, but quick reply.

Since I have the tendancy to hold the stylus at an extreme angle, I had that ridge on the stylus tip scratch up my Visor very badly before I noticed what was going on.

I wrote to the [email protected] address, any only today received their response, not totally positive. It seems they are dubitative that Visor styli are to blame since they cannot replicate the same on their own units. (It must be stressed at this point that the writer said it was an "unauthorized" - also in quotes in the email - investigation.)

I explained in a letter how it happened and received an autoresponse with questions seeming to prove their doubts as to user claims:

> Your email will be added to a list of people with similar
> problems. Any information you can provide will be helpful in
> determining the nature of the problem. Serial numbers will
> help to figure out if the problem is limited to a certain
> time frame. Please comment on the following items:
>
> How many and how deep are the scratches? (can you see them
> clearly looking straight on or do you need to tilt the Visor
> on an angle and catch the light just right?)
>
> Does the stylus scratch the screen all the time or just
> sometimes? If just sometimes, can you rotate the stylus and
> make it scratch more at a certain point?
>
> Did the stylus scratch the screen from the first time you
> used it or did it become more or less scratchy over time?
>
> Have you been careful about keeping the screen clean?
>
> Is there any possibility that your stylus might have picked
> up some abrasive dust?
>
> Do you use heavy pressure on the stylus? The pressure should
> be lighter than typically used for a ball point pen.

It seems with question no2, I am supposed to test drive the stylus again, seeing which part of the ridge wins the damage points award.

Back to Donna. She responded a second time to me saying that she was sending a free 5 pack, but couldn't send it to my overseas address. Why not? Postage too expensive for 0.01 ounces of plastic? She wrote "As you are aware, we do not currently sell our product in Europe. We don't have any vehicle in place to replace your product from there. The reason we don't ship to Europe yet is exactly that .... we don't want to enter a
market until we can fully support customers."

Good point. But I have a Visor, and it's now in Europe. The US post delivers to most civilized countries, I believe. Does this mean that any Visor users who move outside of US territory have their warranty voided? Or that you have to wait to get back to have any service whatsoever?

The warranty states "The repair and replacement process for products or parts in locations outside of the United States will vary depending on Customer's location." According to Donna's e-mail, not only does it VARY, but it's outright VOID. How would a lawyer interpret the word "vary"?

Disappointed to know, since the presence of CityTime in the std. software palette must mean that HS is targetting those who like to travel or have frequent international dealings. If you have a Visor and are not in a country where Handspring is "fully operational", tough luck.

I was originally happy with Donna's rapid response, and I see her as a CEO who goes out of her way to personally make amends. Unfortunately, I am discouraged that she went only halfway, literally, by sending a stylus to my mother in the States to send here to Germany, instead of swallowing the measly $2.00 more. I even offered to pay for the additional postage!

Also, I did not ask for free merchandise, only a stylus that wasn't defective. Her sending the 5-pack which Robert1 writes as being worse than the stock stylus (and probably using the same manufacturing technique) does reassure me that Handspring is at least looking at the problem, but not that they have understood it. Or believe it.

Also, Donna told me that the warranty doesn't NORMALLY cover the screen, since it is prone to abuse. This is understandable. She said that I could wait until operations are established in Europe and the appropriate measures would be taken. Since my warranty is only 90 days, I hope it won't be too late. I e-mailed her with this point, since sending an international registered letter (to prove the submission of my complaint at this time) is rather costly. I'll keep you informed of her reply.

In the meantime, Robert1, obviously, since you received a replacement, they believed your story. What must one do to CONVINCE them?

Registered: Jan 2000
Location:
Posts: 18

I found this on Palm Gear's site. It is a discussion of the best way to protect a palm's screen. http://www8.palmgear.com/faq/faq.cf...=25&catID=1

I just ordered my Visor and I want to protect the best way possible.

Which is the way to protect a Visor's screen?

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: chicago,illinois,usa
Posts: 9

i think the screen is just soft. I don't even use the stylus that came with it and my screen is all scratched up.

Registered: Dec 1999
Location: Durham, NC
Posts: 78

I think I was just in the right place at the right time. A caring soul at Handspring that monitors this board pulled me aside and said, "hey, what's up with these screen scratch issues." So I explained and asked if I could get a new screen. These are not considered by Handspring to be end-user replacable (or they're not yet) so I was asked if I'd Beta Test a procedure for doing a screen swap. I completed this and reported my findings back to Handspring.

Apparantly there's some internal issues going on at Handspring. I think some people there are more customer-centric than others. Some people just want to fix this, others are giving people the run-around. The guy I dealt with has told me that customer service is being outsourced (not Handspring personnel) and they are not fully up-to-speed on how to support the product yet. But they are learning quickly.

He also can NOT reproduce the issue. But I feel he believes others are having the problem and that it is a real issue. I told him that most people, myself included, seem to report that the scratching happens when the styuls is at an extreme angle. I gave him detailed instructions on how to reproduce the issue and also told him to name a time and place and I will demonstrate how to scatch a screen with the stock stylus. I'm quite good at it now. Once I had the old screen out of my visor I got to play with a bit. It's quite easy to scratch when you know how.

The new screen replace procedure is pretty simple except for one tricky part involving insertion of a flex connector. You just have to be super-careful with this step as the parts are VERY flimsy. One wrong move and poof!

I believe if you email to [email protected] and ask for a screen replacement like Robert Larson (that's me) got, you'll probably get one. If not, I suppose we could march on Handspring with torches and pitchforks in hand... If you know your way inside a computer (or better yet a laptop, hand calculator, or VCR remote, you'll be able to do the screen swap procedure).

I keep reading about mixed results with customer service. One guy dropped his visor and smashed his screen and got a replacement Visor no questions asked. Other's can't get their Visor replaced if it has scratches caused by their stylus. I don't get it.

If all else fails, these things ARE covered by warranty. Just call up Handspring and say you got a Visor and it doesn't turn on. I do this all the time with computer vendors (I'm in tech support). Just say, "It's broke." They can take you thru all sorts of troubleshooting steps, but you just maintain your ground and say, "It doesn't turn on. It's broke." Eventually they'll HAVE to send you a new one. Just hotsynch your data, swap out the units and send it back. No one at the factory ever checks RMAs and even if they do, they'll just think "stupid user" and move on... Kinda devious. But it works.

Decent cust svc reps will just replace it no matter what you say. You should be able to call up and say, "oh, I don't like the tint of blue on my blue Visor." And they should replace it. IMO.

Registered: Jan 2000
Location:
Posts: 3

Yes, I'm very sad about this. I think Handspring has some amazing qualities and features over palm. (First considerably their customer service) But, as a lot of people I have seen I have not used the Stylus that came with it out of fear of screatching my screen (i don't want to have to go through the trouble of getting THAT replaced) so I am using an old newton one that is small and cramped..

Maybe Handspring should just grab the stylus out of the unshipped ones and just pop in a matching colored one in the 5-packs. For me it is too late it seems though.

-Jonathan

P.S. I've long been a reader of this board, but only now have I been inspired to post...it's my first real problem with my Visor.

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-FugiMax
[email protected]

[This message has been edited by FugiMax (edited 01-12-2000).]