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Is WinXP Going too far?


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Are you worried about the features MS is building into XP? You do not have permission to vote on this poll.
Hell yes! I'm peeing my pants as we speak!	21	67.74%
Nah, no big deal	10	32.26%
Total:	31 votes	100%

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Topic: Is WinXP Going too far? Pages (4): « 1 [2] 3 4 »

bblue
Member

Registered: Apr 2001
Location: Prison
Posts: 421

Before I start off showing my opinions, two things caused this article.
1: The demise of Netscape's browser business.
2: Looking at Windows XP's media integration features.

---

Microsoft has always been a love it or hate it company. There were times when I thought the world on some of it's software (Earl & Max were too office assistants who actually brightened your day, despite their lack of helpfulness!) But the more I learn about Microsoft's "integration" , the more it starts to shout "monopoly."

This is nothing new.

Look for instance at Netscape. By all means a more intuitive browser (even if it has become more buggy when it's wearing the "N" logo instead of that cool dragon) . If Microsoft had not added the integration feature into Windows, Netscape would still ... well, be in the browser business.

Now my most recent griping is Windows Media. Only a Mac user can TRULY hate this format. Why? Because for as long as the program has existed, Microsoft has given us second rate copies of it. Enough to aggravate us as to wonder why anybody in their right mind uses this format. Now I am seeing it showing up on audio players "Windows Media Compatible!" is a label I appreciate as much as "diet" on a Coke can. I cannot help but feel this is to lure us in to abandoning the beloved Mp3 file in favor of a more aggravating (excuse me, "secure") media format. Let alone, they should have at LEAST used the class-leading Quicktime format. And after looking on how Windows XP will limit our freedom with the file (for "security" reasons) , in favor of the WMP format, I really think it's time to break these guys up.

So what industry next? Will it be Palm? Hop. Palm's got a loyal support crowd. Palm also knows what they are doing, and has a loyal developer community. BUT, that may not be enough.

After all. Microsoft Word, Powerpoint, Outlook, Frontpage, Internet Explorer, Windows Media Player, MSN, etc. did not get where they are today being a better than their competitors....

But the real big question, is that have people become lemmings? Do people use MS products because they feel they "have to?" Do you use Microsoft Word because you feel it is the "Industry Standard" , despite the fact of its bloated price tag?

Just an opinion. Typed with OmniWeb. Thank gawd for Macs!

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06-11-2001 03:20 AM

JHromadka
VisorCentral Staff

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: Texan in Calgary for a while
Posts: 1361

For the sake of argument, what good features will be added in WinXP? All I've seen are the negative aspects of it.

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James Hromadka
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06-11-2001 04:50 AM

dick-richardson
Member

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: Aberdeen, SD
Posts: 2531

Beautiful post, bblue. Now why in the *%&$ do you have to post all than inane garbage? I don't get it.

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Abortion: Darwinism at its finest.

06-11-2001 05:31 AM

foo fighter
Member

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: I'm not sure, but I see lots of lights everywhere.
Posts: 1287

quote:
Originally posted by JHromadka
For the sake of argument, what good features will be added in WinXP? All I've seen are the negative aspects of it.

For starters, unlike the Windows 9x/ME client which is built on a geriatric DOS kernel, XP is based on the same NT kernel as Windows 2000 Pro. The result: an OS that almost never crashes! I'm still using the earlier Beta 2 release (build 2462), and despite all the abuse I've given this poor old system, it still hasn't crashed since the day I first installed it. No kidding! Regardless of what I may think of Microsoft's business practices, I can't throw tomatoes at the development work that's been done on this OS. Aside from improved stability, there are a number of very useful new features for better usability. The most notable new feature that everyone is talking about, is the revamped GUI. It looks cleaner, warmer, friendlier, and is much more focused than earlier Windows UI. In fact, I hate to say this to Mac users, but Windows is going to have the edge now in ease of use. Especially for first time users. From the green start button, to clearly labeled Internet and e-mail links in the start menu, to dedicated directories for digital media (My Music, and My Pictures)...XP makes using your PC a snap. Another nice touch is the new skinnable interface. I absolutely hate the default "Whistler" theme, and the new color variations; Metallic and Homestead, are also pretty lame. But supposedly Microsoft will be offering more skins for download and there is already a link within the Desktop Properties panel to "Get more themes". Oddly enough, clicking that link takes you to the WindowsMedia site. Hmm..strange. You can also bet Microsoft will offer yet another money grabbing Plus Pack to go along with XP. There are also a number of interface tweaks similar to MacOS X hidden away; drop shadows under menus, animated minimizing windows, transparency effects to the task bar, and a very nice font smoothing engine (ClearType). All in all, MS has done a very nice job with the UI. I'm just not blown away by it, and I still don't think its anywhere near as elegant as OS X. But hey, that's me.

Overall, I think XP is going to be the best operating system Microsoft has ever...EVER developed. Seriously! The real question is what mischievous plans are in store for users who adopt it, either willingly or unwillingly, and how XP will fit into .NET? And the biggest question may be; Will XP save the PC industry from the crap hole it's in right now? I'm dubious. I still think consumers will be more enthusiastic about the X Box than XP.

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Last edited by foo fighter on 06-11-2001 at 07:33 AM

06-11-2001 07:25 AM

akur
Member

Registered: Jan 2001
Location: Seattle, Washington
Posts: 293

Foo fighter, I agree with you about the stability and the GUI of Xp beta 2. I can't wait for RC1.

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06-11-2001 09:11 AM

septimus
VisorCentral Staff

Registered: Feb 2001
Location: Them Twin Cities
Posts: 1758

quote:
Originally posted by JHromadka
I've been warning my friends about the gotchas that XP brings, and I think MS is going to see a lot of home users sticking with 98 or 2K, or even switching to the Mac.

Like this home user right here. I'm running Win98 at home, and well, I don't like it so much. I don't need much from a computer, but I do need stability, friendliness, ease of use, and the ability to feel good about myself the morning after. I can't afford to upgrade in the near future, but when I can, I'm eyeing the iBook.

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06-11-2001 02:22 PM

dick-richardson
Member

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: Aberdeen, SD
Posts: 2531

foo, is the shut down menu still under the start menu?

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Abortion: Darwinism at its finest.

06-11-2001 03:42 PM

foo fighter
Member

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: I'm not sure, but I see lots of lights everywhere.
Posts: 1287

quote:
Originally posted by dick-richardson
foo, is the shut down menu still under the start menu?

Yes, but it has been revamped. You are now given a choice of: Hibernate...Turn Off..Restart. Much simpler than earlier implementations.

Attachment: shut_down.jpg
This has been downloaded 73 time(s).

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06-11-2001 04:39 PM

bblue
Member

Registered: Apr 2001
Location: Prison
Posts: 421

Well

P.S. Thank you Mr. Moderator for moving that onto this thread. (I am serious, for once!) Much appreciation!

Oh well.

By All means, Windows 2000, while light years ahead of Win98 in terms of stability, is nowhere NEAR as reliable as OSX. (I'm typing this off of it as I speak, and had to re-start my computer after I.E. (they don't have NS here! For shame!)died and gave me the "restart" notion.

This is NOT the first time. It happened while typing a paper about 3 weeks ago. And about every other time I access an ftp server, the computer would hang on me.

This does not seem to be a problem for OSX with that wonderful program from Panic!

I have been hosting my own web site & radio stream off of my computer with OSX. Never have had it lock up & kill itself like Win98 & OS 8.1 always did.

P.S. Sorry about the sloppiness of this post. Windows 2000 has lost the function of the delete button.

The irony in this world....

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06-11-2001 05:30 PM

dick-richardson
Member

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: Aberdeen, SD
Posts: 2531

quote:
Originally posted by foo fighter
Yes, but it has been revamped. You are now given a choice of: Hibernate...Turn Off..Restart. Much simpler than earlier implementations.

That's still counter-intuitive for beginners. I think that XP (while having a better GUI than other windows' implementations) is still lacking for simplicity when compared to a mac. It's just the way the OS's are designed. Mac makes everyday use very easy, while "hiding" its more powerful features; whereas Windows keeps almost everything accessible (meaning you have to wade through a few more menu options than on a mac). Although, I have to say that Windows is becoming more and more mac-like every version (except that my "assistant" can beat up your "wizard" any day

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Abortion: Darwinism at its finest.

06-11-2001 06:27 PM

JHromadka
VisorCentral Staff

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: Texan in Calgary for a while
Posts: 1361

Looks like there won't be MP3 at all in WMP on XP.

Foo, can the Internet and mail links in XP be changed, or is that only for MS products? Also, what makes XP better than 2K? 98/ME is buggy, but I have very few problems with 2K.

I never cared too much for themes. I played with them back when Plus! first came out, but found myself going back to the default after a while.

To be honest, I think that MS needs to copy Apple more on shutting down the computer. I like hitting the power button and getting a screen of options for shut down, sleep, etc.

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Old Friend

06-11-2001 09:41 PM

akur
Member

Registered: Jan 2001
Location: Seattle, Washington
Posts: 293

Foo, where do you get that wallpaper? can I have it too? If you can send me the file via email.
Thank's

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06-11-2001 09:50 PM

sdoersam
Member

Registered: Aug 2000
Location: Glen Burnie, Maryland
Posts: 205

quote:
Originally posted by JHromadka
To be honest, I think that MS needs to copy Apple more on shutting down the computer. I like hitting the power button and getting a screen of options for shut down, sleep, etc.

Already there. There is an option in Windows XP (under power management) to tell the power button what to do. One of the options is "Prompt me on what to do." I just set it and tried it, and it works exactly as you described. I can also just set it to a non-prompted default setting as well. (ie. always power off)

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06-11-2001 09:56 PM

akur
Member

Registered: Jan 2001
Location: Seattle, Washington
Posts: 293

quote:
Originally posted by JHromadka

Foo, can the Internet and mail links in XP be changed, or is that only for MS products? Also, what makes XP better than 2K? 98/ME is buggy, but I have very few problems with 2K.

[/B]

Do you mean this links?

Yeah, it can be change (as long it's a browser or an email program) or if you want, you can have an option to not display anything on that area.

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06-11-2001 10:04 PM

foo fighter
Member

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: I'm not sure, but I see lots of lights everywhere.
Posts: 1287

quote:
Originally posted by JHromadka
Foo, can the Internet and mail links in XP be changed, or is that only for MS products? Also, what makes XP better than 2K? 98/ME is buggy, but I have very few problems with 2K.

As akur already pointed out, you can change the links to ANY browser or email application, but only those. You can't switch your browser to Dreamweaver, for example.

What makes XP better than 2k? Well, basically XP is 2k. But what really makes it a better option, aside from the skinnable interface (which I hate), is that it offers vastly superior multimedia performance over 2k. Windows 2000 was an excellent choice as a workstation OS for doing business and productivity tasks, but it stank as a multimedia savvy platform. Every game I loaded under 98 ran fine, but drug its feet under Win2k. So that alone is a good reason for upgrading.

quote:
I never cared too much for themes. I played with them back when Plus! first came out, but found myself going back to the default after a while.

Neither did I. No matter how long I would play around with themes, I always went back to the default settings. Even the sound effects became annoying. But under XP, these themes (referred to as Visual Styles) are a completely different animal. They allow for skinning the entire UI. Something that before was only possible with third party software like WindowBlinds (or Kaleidoscope for the Mac). The problem I have with these new "themes" is that, well...they SUCK! I mean, look at them. They are campy, tasteless, and without any depth. What's even more frustrating is that MS is keeping these theme files proprietary, so you can't create your own themes..ever. I really hope Microsoft either allows for creating custom themes, or they hire some real graphic artists who know what the hell they are doing. So far, I am really..really turned off by the new UI.

quote:
To be honest, I think that MS needs to copy Apple more on shutting down the computer. I like hitting the power button and getting a screen of options for shut down, sleep, etc.

Oh, don't worry. When it comes to copying Apple, Microsoft is a genius!

By the way, akur (or anyone who is interested), here are all of the wallpapers from XP:

http://www.dcwshosting.com/~neowin....ens/wallpapers/

My favorite is "Bliss". Rolling green pastures, soothing blue skies..ZZZZ...ZZZZZ...ZZZZ

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Last edited by foo fighter on 06-11-2001 at 11:38 PM

06-11-2001 11:24 PM

akur
Member

Registered: Jan 2001
Location: Seattle, Washington
Posts: 293

Thank's for the link!
My favorite wallpaper is red moon desert. I think it's the coolest!

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06-12-2001 12:04 AM

dick-richardson
Member

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: Aberdeen, SD
Posts: 2531

I downloaded StoneHenge for use as my background when I tire of the leprechaun roped to a tree.

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-Joshua
Abortion: Darwinism at its finest.

06-12-2001 12:27 AM

foo fighter
Member

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: I'm not sure, but I see lots of lights everywhere.
Posts: 1287

quote:
Originally posted by dick-richardson
That's still counter-intuitive for beginners. I think that XP (while having a better GUI than other windows' implementations) is still lacking for simplicity when compared to a mac.

Going to the start menu to shut down your PC is definitely an ass backwards method. As to the Mac being simpler to use than a PC..well, I think that's slowly turning into a bugaboo. Windowing is windowing, no matter what platform you are using. Granted, Microsoft had the farthest way to go, in terms of usability, but they are slowly matching Apple. In the end it comes down to what you feel most comfortable with.

quote:
It's just the way the OS's are designed. Mac makes everyday use very easy, while "hiding" its more powerful features; whereas Windows keeps almost everything accessible (meaning you have to wade through a few more menu options than on a mac). Although, I have to say that Windows is becoming more and more mac-like every version (except that my "assistant" can beat up your "wizard" any day ).

Oddly enough, Windows is becoming more and more of a platform for newbies, and less of a platform for power users. It's almost as if Microsoft and Apple were trading places! This is one of the reasons why I'm slowly being drawn to the Mac platform. I really love what Apple is doing with OS X, and I think one day..when the OS really is finished, it will surpass Windows. Apple is gaining the attention of many PC users. Go to Ars Technica (a PC enthusiast site), and look through the new Mac forum. There are tons of PC users buying iBooks and PowerBooks (I'm in there too), who are excited about MacOS X. Apple is turning PC users heads, and that says a lot. People are getting tired of Microsoft's bullsh!t. XP, Hailstorm, and .NET could be (as one tech journalist put it) Microsoft's Waterloo.

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06-12-2001 12:30 AM

slotmachine
Member

Registered: Jun 2001
Location: Yes.
Posts: 358

Split Personality

I am horrified as a consumer, and gleeful as a developer abour Bill's New Windows Order. I plan to 1) make an additional backup of my Win 2K and Office 2K CDs, because I will obviously be using those for a long time and 2) Buy Microsoft Stock.

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06-12-2001 12:41 AM

JHromadka
VisorCentral Staff

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: Texan in Calgary for a while
Posts: 1361

quote:
Originally posted by foo fighter
What makes XP better than 2k? Well, basically XP is 2k. But what really makes it a better option, aside from the skinnable interface (which I hate), is that it offers vastly superior multimedia performance over 2k.

Ah, well since the only PC game I play is Solitaire (that's why I have a Nintendo), it doesn't look like there was that much for me anyway in XP. So no big loss for me there.

The day that Palm Desktop and PhotoShop come to OS X in native form (I refuse to run Classic apps) will see my usage of my home Dell drop dramatically.

I think the fur will really start flying when more details on Hailstorm surface.

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James Hromadka
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06-12-2001 12:51 AM

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