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Topic: Server Connections in OSX.1

Vinny
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Registered: Mar 2000
Location: NC, Indiana
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Server Connections in OSX.1

Is there any application that will list available resources on windows networks or do you just have to know the address of the resource you are trying to access?

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01-19-2002 06:57 PM

homer
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Location: Twin Cities, MN
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Not sure what you mean by 'resouces'.

If you are talking networking OSX machines and PCs, then you either need an intermidiary server, or software on either the OSX machine or the Windows machine.

Options would include putting Samba on OSX (allows PCs to see you), run Virtual PC on OSX (allows you to act as a PC on the network), or MacPCLan on a PC (allows the PC to join an appletalk network).

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01-19-2002 09:24 PM

Toby
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quote:
Originally posted by homer
Not sure what you mean by 'resouces'. [...]

He would be talking about 'shares' in Windows parlance. Shared directories, printers, etc. Doesn't OS X come with SMB already (the Apple myths page certainly suggests so)?

01-20-2002 12:52 AM

Vinny
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Location: NC, Indiana
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Toby

10.1+ have had Samba installed--but it doesn't actually list the "shares" available on windows networks from what I understand, you have to know the names or IP addresses. I think it's pretty crappy of Apple to tell Windows users they can effectively use Windows networks when they can't even get a listing. I was wanting to know if there was a way.

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01-20-2002 01:00 AM

Toby
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quote:
Originally posted by Vinny
10.1+ have had Samba installed--but it doesn't actually list the "shares" available on windows networks from what I understand, you have to know the names or IP addresses. I think it's pretty crappy of Apple to tell Windows users they can effectively use Windows networks when they can't even get a listing. I was wanting to know if there was a way.

Ah...OK, considering that I'm looking hard at getting an iMac in a few months, I had a vested interest in checking this out. There's at least one solution evidently. I would think the guy that made Dave for previous versions of MacOS might have something, too.
edit:Yep. Dave does it as well. I'd go with Dave.

Last edited by Toby on 01-20-2002 at 01:38 AM

01-20-2002 01:21 AM

homer
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I am new to Samba myself. I was under the impression that Samba was for PC users to see the machine running Samba, not the other way around (basically Samba sets up a shared directory visible to windows). Is that correct?

Apple REALLY should have gotten Macs to plug-and-play into a PC network. It's a shame they haven't. Microsoft has even done their share and has supported Appletalk on their network servers.

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01-20-2002 02:56 AM

Vinny
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Toby

Thanks for the links. Sharity even has a free student license!

Homer

Apple claims it does http://www.apple.com/myths/ see Myth 2 . I don't understand (if what I've heard is true) why it's so difficult to get it to list the shares on a network.

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01-20-2002 06:53 AM

homer
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Wow...that video on the apple site is about as vague as they could get.

Toby...that link was interesting. Here's what it mentions:

quote:
Sharity is a client for the CIFS (Common Internet File System) protocol, formerly known as SMB (Server Message Block). This is the file-sharing protocol used by Windows NT, 95, 98, 2000, ME, Windows for Workgroups, OS/2, Samba and many others. Sharity mounts these servers in your file system. Mounting means that you can open files directly from the server with any application you like, as if they were on a local disk. Other clients (such as smbclient from the Samba suite) provide only an ftp-like interface where you can copy files to and from the share but cannot open them directly on the server.

Going back to the Apple video, the window that pops up is labeled SMB/CIFS

So, the question is, is the video on the Apple site showing OSX's built-in support for SMB/CIFS or is it actually showing us a video of the Sharity applicatoin?...which, while it works, is third party software not included on OSX. (or does OSX merely bundle the demo and claim it as out-of-the-box functionality?)

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01-20-2002 06:34 PM

Vinny
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What exactly is AppleTalk? I'm confused by it--is this what causes macs to be incompatible with windows network?

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01-20-2002 07:35 PM

homer
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Appletalk is simply the protocol that macs use to talk to each other over the network. Back in the day, there were also Appletalk cables that you'd daisy chain all of your macs together with. Nowadays, you obviously run ethernet networks.

The problem is that PC don't use Appletalk as their networking protocol. In otherwords, Macs and PCs don't speak the same network language, so you can't just plug them into each other and expect them to understand what the other is saying.

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01-20-2002 10:51 PM

Vinny
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Are samba (SMB) and CIFS what windows has always used? Or are they some future networking standards that both macs, pcs, and *nix boxes will use and Apple just recently added support for in 10.1?

Thanks for your help

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01-20-2002 11:24 PM

Toby
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quote:
Originally posted by homer
I am new to Samba myself. I was under the impression that Samba was for PC users to see the machine running Samba, not the other way around (basically Samba sets up a shared directory visible to windows). Is that correct?

Nope, Samba is basically SMB (the standard which Windows networks use to both advertise themselves for shares and find out which other shares are out there) for *nix. It fools Windows machines into thinking a *nix machine is another Windows machine. Unfortunately, Samba doesn't include a 'Network Neighborhood' type GUI function. There are a few for Linux out there, and there are probably more than just the two for OS X that I found.

01-22-2002 08:22 PM

Toby
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quote:
Originally posted by Vinny
Are samba (SMB) and CIFS what windows has always used? Or are they some future networking standards that both macs, pcs, and *nix boxes will use and Apple just recently added support for in 10.1?

SMB has been around as long as Windows NT, IIRC. CIFS is basically just SMB renamed in order to make it sound like a standard. It's only a future networking standard in the sense that Microsoft's market share is big enough to practically force support of it from an installed base perspective.

01-22-2002 08:27 PM

sowens
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Registered: Sep 2000
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 284

Re: Server Connections in OSX.1

quote:
Originally posted by Vinny
Is there any application that will list available resources on windows networks or do you just have to know the address of the resource you are trying to access?

Ok, first question that needs to be asked is: what, exactly, is the problem you're trying to solve.

Access to PC resources can be had through the smbclient utility that should come with every Samba release. It offers an FTP-like interface (read: text mode) to SMB resources. IF all you want to do is copy files from a PC, then this may be a way to do it.

There is smbfs, which is an SMB file system extension to Linux that allows browsing, but I don't know much more than that. It may have already been ported to freeBSD, and thus OSX, but I have no idea where to begin looking for that.

If you want to copy files between a friend's PC and your own, spend the time to learn how to set up Samba and have him copy the files to your machine. Believe it or not, modifying the smb.conf file isn't that hard, and once you get it set up to work with one machine, getting it to work with others isn't hard (usually it doesn't require any further effort, since most people just leave their PC's in the "Workgroup" group (or whatever they call it on the PC side).

As always, the place to start looking for Samba info is www.samba.org

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01-22-2002 09:48 PM

Vinny
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Registered: Mar 2000
Location: NC, Indiana
Posts: 465

The goal would be to have the same full browseable access of PC networks as I would with an actual win machine. This includes access to information on servers and setting up a share on the PC that people can access through the network.

Thanks for your help guys!

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01-22-2002 10:01 PM

Toby
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Re: Re: Server Connections in OSX.1

quote:
Originally posted by sowens
Ok, first question that needs to be asked is: what, exactly, is the problem you're trying to solve. [...]

Seems that he's looking for a "Network Neighborhood" type solution for Mac OS X... something that'll graphically show the available computers and shares on the network, and also allow him to point and click and add mapped devices on his Mac. Do you have direct experience with Sharity, Dave, or a similar product. I, for one, would certainly be interested in such experiences.

01-23-2002 04:44 PM

sowens
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Registered: Sep 2000
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 284

Don't have any experience with any of those products, since I've never needed any of them.

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01-23-2002 05:14 PM

Vinny
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Registered: Mar 2000
Location: NC, Indiana
Posts: 465

Re: Re: Re: Server Connections in OSX.1

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
Seems that he's looking for a "Network Neighborhood" type solution for Mac OS X...

That's exactly what I am looking for.

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01-23-2002 08:14 PM

ashmed
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Registered: Mar 2001
Location: San Diego, California
Posts: 441

After reading this thread, I went and downloaded Sharity for my roommate's G4 (free student license of course). It worked flawlessly right after we installed it and since has not worked. Only see "entire network" in cifs, bringing back evil memories of networking win95 machines at home.

Anybody know how to get this to work again?

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01-23-2002 09:57 PM

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