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terrysalmi
Member

Registered: Feb 2002
Location: Washburn University in Topeka, KS
Posts: 450

Okay - I don't like all these long quoted posts. New Inane Topic -

How 'bout them College World Series? Right here in good old Omaha Nebraska! The hometown favorite is of course, Nebraska, but I have a soft spot for (the Ramblin' Wreck of) Georgia Tech.

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06-12-2002 08:59 PM

septimus
VisorCentral Staff

Registered: Feb 2001
Location: Them Twin Cities
Posts: 1758

quote:
Originally posted by terrysalmi
Okay -

Who said it was okay?

quote:
I don't like all these long quoted posts.

so what? Toby will jump down your throat over his right to post that way. Just watch, he'll even jump down my throat for speaking for him in that way. He's just covered in mucous.

quote:
New Inane Topic -

Who's to say what's inane? who's to say what's New? This thread is coming up on 1k posts, can you really believe that it hasn't covered everything already? It all depends on what "is" is.

quote:
How 'bout them College World Series?

Be careful or I'll sick Miradu on your grammer.

quote:
Right here in good old Omaha Nebraska!

Somewhere in middle america? Man, old town is pretty cool and all, but something rubs me wrong there.

quote:
The hometown favorite is of course, Nebraska,

that's huskercentrism, you should really be more accepting.

quote:
but I have a soft spot

dropped as a baby? You should really get that check out.

quote:
for (the Ramblin' Wreck of) Georgia Tech.

Zing!

...this message brought to you by the national quote parsers of america, who believe that, well, we like parsing quotes so it would take too damn long to tell you what we believe in and anyway the message would get lost in all those cuts and retorts and such, so why bother when it will just get dissected and the real issue will be lost? huh? what?

BANG!

...sorry about that, everybody, my cat stepped all over the keyboard. What were we talking about?

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06-12-2002 09:17 PM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by dick-richardson
And history verifies my claims as well - which reaffirms my assertions regarding individual decision for or against a specific religion. There is a 'cattle' aspect of relgion as well.

Then I suppose you don't believe in the New Testament or Christianity being able to apply to the Gentiles? After all, the Bible is nothing more than the propaganda of a budding religion to get new recruits, and the whole concept of Christianity not just applying to Jews comes from one 'strong ape'.

quote:
I knew that was coming. Which came first, the chicken or the egg?

The egg.

quote:
You reject the possibility that the strongest ape attributed his power to a god, and beat that belief into the other apes?

Nope, but that ape's dead.

quote:
And the possibility that same ape had problems ruling the other apes, so he beat 'morality' into the other apes so they would fall in line?

No, I don't reject that possibility, but again, the ape's dead, and yet the belief lives. Or should I bring up my corrolary about people's seeming need for a belief in an afterlife because the current one isn't always fair?

quote:
It would probably do some nice business, unless it were an actual computer exorcism - which I was referring to.

There is no such thing as an 'actual computer exorcism', hence whatever the person who coins the term in a business says it is, it can become. So, if I want to say that an exorcism is to reinstall to purge the demons from the hard drive, or replace the 'possessed' component with a 'blessed' one, then so it is written, so it shall be done. Quite honestly, most laypeople consider computer jargon about as intelligible as a Latin exorcism rite anyway. Performing such 'computer exorcisms' is just eccentric enough to be a neat business idea.

quote:
Not I. I stated that if there was 'The Beginning,' it requires God.

No, if there is a God (in the Judeo-Christian sense), there can be no "The Beginning" (despite the bad phrasing in Genesis which could be due to bad translation, IOW, '_our_ beginning', or 'the beginning of human origins').

quote:
I also pointed out that time has to have had a beginning, or there would be no time. I did not assert that the beginning of time was 'The Beginning.'

You asserted that there was a provable beginning, when there is no such thing.

06-12-2002 09:29 PM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by septimus
Who said it was okay?

Must've been dubya.

quote:
so what? Toby will jump down your throat over his right to post that way.

Its muh Gawd giv'n raht as a Merkin.

quote:
Just watch, he'll even jump down my throat for speaking for him in that way.

You seem to have an oral/laryngeal fixation. Have you been reading Fraud again?

quote:
He's just covered in mucous.

Well, if you were having a really bad allergy incident, you would be too. C'mere, lemme sneeze on ya. Maybe I should eat more fresh fruit.

quote:
Who's to say what's inane? who's to say what's New? This thread is coming up on 1k posts, can you really believe that it hasn't covered everything already?

All right, bananas? We haven't done them, have we?

quote:
It all depends on what "is" is.

Can't we do something else?

quote:
Be careful or I'll sick Miradu on your grammer.

Personally, I'd have found it much funnier with 'sic' (which would work on multiple levels).

quote:
Somewhere in middle america? Man, old town is pretty cool and all, but something rubs me wrong there.

How about Central America instead?

quote:
that's huskercentrism, you should really be more accepting.

um...is that possible from a diehard Bushie?

quote:
dropped as a baby? You should really get that check out.

Ouch.

quote:
...this message brought to you by the national quote parsers of america,

They have one of those?

quote:
who believe that, well, we like parsing quotes

Especially if it helps clarity, no doubt.

quote:
so it would take too damn long to tell you what we believe in

You could try.

quote:
and anyway the message would get lost in all those cuts and retorts and such,

You had a message? Was it in a bottle?

quote:
so why bother when it will just get dissected

I always liked biology class, but I didn't really care for the dissections.

quote:
and the real issue will be lost?

Maybe the mailman just delivered your issue to the wrong house. Ask around with your neighbors.

quote:
huh? what?

BANG!

...sorry about that, everybody, my cat stepped all over the keyboard. What were we talking about?

What to do if someone attacks you with a pointed stick.

06-12-2002 09:52 PM

Yorick
Member

Registered: Mar 2001
Location: Out of my skull, back in five minutes
Posts: 1435

stop it ... yerr killin me ...

thanks guys -- I've had a trying day, I needed the jolt.

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06-12-2002 10:04 PM

dick-richardson
Member

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: Aberdeen, SD
Posts: 2531

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
Then I suppose you don't believe in the New Testament or Christianity being able to apply to the Gentiles?...

I believe in it as much as I believe the Koran/et al. applies to me.

quote:
Nope, but that ape's dead.

There has always been a stronger ape.

quote:
Or should I bring up my corrolary about people's seeming need for a belief in an afterlife because the current one isn't always fair?

If I can bring up the fact that not all people believe in an afterlife because this one's unfair.

quote:
There is no such thing as an 'actual computer exorcism'...

But an exorcism is traditionaly a prayer rite, and operates under the belief that demons are in direct control of the object possessed. I'll chant over a few systems here with the customer present and let you know how it works.

quote:
No, if there is a God (in the Judeo-Christian sense), there can be no "The Beginning" (despite the bad phrasing in Genesis which could be due to bad translation, IOW, '_our_ beginning', or 'the beginning of human origins').

Why not? Regardless, I think it time to define 'The Beginning.' It is meant to designate the beginning of everything - and not just everything as we know it. Everything.

quote:
You asserted that there was a provable beginning, when there is no such thing.

A proveable beginning of time, not 'The Beginning.'

__________________
-Joshua
Abortion: Darwinism at its finest.

06-12-2002 10:34 PM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by dick-richardson
I believe in it as much as I believe the Koran/et al. applies to me.

So you've converted to Islam? Cool.

quote:
There has always been a stronger ape.

So God is just the strongest ape then. Interesting.

quote:
If I can bring up the fact that not all people believe in an afterlife because this one's unfair.

Now you're just being obtuse.

quote:
But an exorcism is traditionaly a prayer rite,

Which doesn't apply to computers.

quote:
and operates under the belief that demons are in direct control of the object possessed.

Which means that the object must be cleansed of its possession.

quote:
I'll chant over a few systems here with the customer present and let you know how it works.

They'll just see you for the whacko that you are. My exorcisms are much less patronizing, and the customer gets to be in on the joke.

quote:
Why not?

Because if The Word existed prior to The Beginning, then it wasn't The Beginning.

quote:
Regardless, I think it time to define 'The Beginning.' It is meant to designate the beginning of everything - and not just everything as we know it. Everything.

Then it doesn't exist in Judeo-Christian concepts. God is without beginning or end. He is infinite.

quote:
A proveable beginning of time, not 'The Beginning.'

It doesn't exist either.

06-12-2002 10:49 PM

dick-richardson
Member

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: Aberdeen, SD
Posts: 2531

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
So God is just the strongest ape then. Interesting.

Maybe.

quote:
Now you're just being obtuse.

Actually, that was the original point I was making.

quote:
Which doesn't apply to computers.

Why not?

quote:
They'll just see you for the whacko that you are.

Well then.

quote:
My exorcisms are much less patronizing, and the customer gets to be in on the joke.

So you're saying that their comments about the computer being possessed isn't proof of people needing an explanation of the mysterious? Hmmm. Sounds familiar.

quote:
Because if The Word existed prior to The Beginning, then it wasn't The Beginning.

Exactly my point. The Beginning is God.

quote:
It doesn't exist either.

Why not?

__________________
-Joshua
Abortion: Darwinism at its finest.

06-12-2002 11:20 PM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by dick-richardson
Actually, that was the original point I was making.

That you were obtuse? Oh, well if you'd have said that we'd have no debate.

quote:
Why not?

Because despite whatever anthropomorphism people put onto them, they're inanimate.

quote:
That's very nice of you. So you're saying that their comments about the computer being possessed isn't proof of people needing an explanation of the mysterious?

No, I'm saying that just because people have silly beliefs doesn't mean that I'd want to exploit that and make them feel foolish.

quote:
Hmmm. Sounds familiar.

Somehow I doubt it.

quote:
Exactly my point. The Beginning is God.

Where did he start then?

quote:
Why not?

Exactly. Why not? I'm going home and have a beer.

06-12-2002 11:27 PM

dick-richardson
Member

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: Aberdeen, SD
Posts: 2531

quote:
Originally posted by septimus
and anyway the message would get lost in all those cuts and retorts and such

Who can slice a finer filet?

__________________
-Joshua
Abortion: Darwinism at its finest.

06-12-2002 11:28 PM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by dick-richardson
Who can slice a finer filet?

Cher, you want to borrow my knife? It's great for fileting the fish you catch while trolling.

06-12-2002 11:35 PM

dick-richardson
Member

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: Aberdeen, SD
Posts: 2531

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
That you were obtuse?

No, that all people don't necessarily believe in religion for your stated reasons, just as all people don't necessarily believe in the afterlife because this one's unfair.

quote:
Because despite whatever anthropomorphism people put onto them, they're inanimate.

I didn't realize that precluded possession.

quote:
No, I'm saying that just because people have silly beliefs doesn't mean that I'd want to exploit that and make them feel foolish.

Superfluous to the argument; demonstrating a complete misread to the intent behind my argument. I give this response * out of a possible *****.

quote:
Somehow I doubt it.

Yeah, I guess not.

quote:
Where did he start then?

He's kind of a self-starter. Or He doesn't exist.

__________________
-Joshua
Abortion: Darwinism at its finest.

06-13-2002 12:12 AM

dick-richardson
Member

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: Aberdeen, SD
Posts: 2531

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
Cher, you want to borrow my knife? It's great for fileting the fish you catch while trolling.

If that's what it takes to dismiss my arguments...

__________________
-Joshua
Abortion: Darwinism at its finest.

06-13-2002 12:21 AM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by dick-richardson
No, that all people don't necessarily believe in religion for your stated reasons, just as all people don't necessarily believe in the afterlife because this one's unfair.

It seems that you're trying to read more into my statements than is there. I'm saying that those are basic human reasons for believing in those things. People may have a plethora of other reasons in addition to them (some of them may even be quite rational, although the premises might be something we'd have considered silly superstition or dementia were we talking about 'ancient' religions, e.g 'ancient astronauts', etc.).

quote:
I didn't realize that precluded possession.

What is there to possess if it has no animating force?

quote:
Superfluous to the argument; demonstrating a complete misread to the intent behind my argument. I give this response * out of a possible *****.

It's not all about your argument, Josh.

quote:
Yeah, I guess not.

Can't win 'em all.

quote:
He's kind of a self-starter. Or He doesn't exist.

Then I guess the Judeo-Christian God doesn't exist, because one of His characteristics is that He has always been and will always be.

06-13-2002 01:34 PM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by dick-richardson
If that's what it takes to dismiss my arguments...

?? I think you missed a joke, Josh. It was a joke referring to my troll in the Entourage thread (the one you bit on).

06-13-2002 01:36 PM

dick-richardson
Member

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: Aberdeen, SD
Posts: 2531

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
It seems that you're trying to read more into my statements than is there. I'm saying that those are basic human reasons for believing in those things. People may have a plethora of other reasons in addition to them (some of them may even be quite rational, although the premises might be something we'd have considered silly superstition or dementia were we talking about 'ancient' religions, e.g 'ancient astronauts', etc.).

My problem is that I don't agree that your basic human reasons are prerequisite for that belief. I, personally, don't believe in God because I need to have an explanation for the mysterious, nor do I have any problem with the thought that my only roll after death is 175 lbs of fertilizer.

quote:
What is there to possess if it has no animating force?

Ever seen Child's Play?

quote:
Then I guess the Judeo-Christian God doesn't exist, because one of His characteristics is that He has always been and will always be.

That's what I meant by 'self-starter.' It was clever yesterday...

quote:
?? I think you missed a joke, Josh. It was a joke referring to my troll in the Entourage thread (the one you bit on).

And I think you are right. Friends don't let friends mix threads.

__________________
-Joshua
Abortion: Darwinism at its finest.

06-13-2002 03:29 PM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by dick-richardson
My problem is that I don't agree that your basic human reasons are prerequisite for that belief. I, personally, don't believe in God because I need to have an explanation for the mysterious, nor do I have any problem with the thought that my only roll after death is 175 lbs of fertilizer.

I really wish I had time to hear the explanation of that one. I'm sure it would be priceless.

quote:
Ever seen Child's Play?

Yes, I saw The Matrix, too.

quote:
That's what I meant by 'self-starter.' It was clever yesterday...

But without a beginning, there is no 'start'.

quote:
And I think you are right. Friends don't let friends mix threads.

I hold in each of my hands a pill. Red or Blue?

06-13-2002 03:46 PM

dick-richardson
Member

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: Aberdeen, SD
Posts: 2531

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
I really wish I had time to hear the explanation of that one. I'm sure it would be priceless.

Why I believe in God? It's not that interesting, really.

quote:
Yes, I saw The Matrix, too.

There were no possessions in The Matrix.

quote:
[B]But without a beginning, there is no 'start'.

As I said, it was clever yesterday.

quote:
I hold in each of my hands a pill. Red or Blue?

I have no problem accepting that all may be illusion. But along the lines of the 'Cogito ergo Sum,' have no way to disprove my senses. They define my reality. Even Neo was acting entirely on his sensory imput.

__________________
-Joshua
Abortion: Darwinism at its finest.

06-13-2002 04:12 PM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by dick-richardson
Why I believe in God? It's not that interesting, really.

Which God?

quote:
There were no possessions in The Matrix.

It's a movie. What's it have to do with anything?

quote:
I have no problem accepting that all may be illusion. But along the lines of the 'Cogito ergo Sum,' have no way to disprove my senses. They define my reality. Even Neo was acting entirely on his sensory imput.

But if sensory input can be faked (or subject to defects like schizophrenia), it all goes out the window. "Ma ma ma, we're all crazy now!"

06-13-2002 04:48 PM

NeilMcD
Member

Registered: Apr 2002
Location:
Posts: 74

'splaining movies..

adding to the allure of inane ramblings:

childs play was about a doll that is possessed by an evil spirit. Hence, josh's comment about no possessions in matrix.

06-13-2002 05:24 PM

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