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Abid
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Registered: Jan 2003
Location:
Posts: 5

American Interests vs. The World

American foreign policy is very predictable. All it's actions are selfish and serve only American interests. As it is the sole superpower in the world, it can basically do what it wants and does so without any thought of repercussions for others.

This omnipotent attitude is not stable. It can only perpetuate terrorism and lead to greater instability in the world. Look at the recent world non-alligned movement summit in Malaysia and the statements made by the world leaders attending. Most fear what difficulties this big bully in the world will bring about by it's irresponsible and selfish actions.

This is the new terror the world is facing.

02-26-2003 03:37 PM

Digisane
Member

Registered: Jun 2002
Location: By the toilet.
Posts: 174

Re: American Interests vs. The World

quote:
Originally posted by Abid
This is the new terror the world is facing.

Wow, my parents worked hard and sent my sister to the terrorists to further her studies and learn music production engineering.

Normally, I don't give a damn about this sort of things, but this is something that relates quite closely with me so I'd suggest that you'd better think twice over what you say.

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02-26-2003 06:08 PM

ilovedessert
Member

Registered: Jan 2003
Location:
Posts: 37

Papa Bush was head of the CIA and thereforwe a spy, he helped create the mess we have now. In fact, if he did nto do half a job in Iraq. This would not be an issue.

Bottom line W used Iraq as a cover for screwing up the economy and now it is blowing up in his face.

the meantime, his rich friends in the oil and and defence contractors are making $ hand over fist.

W is a moron and has perhaps the lowest IQ of any one who has been in the white house.

02-26-2003 10:30 PM

BobbyMike
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Registered: Dec 1999
Location: "Children are a gift from God, they are a reward"
Posts: 1049

This thread is troll bait

Digisane, they probably have thought twice about what they said. Being closed minded and prejudiced is very mentally taxing.

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02-27-2003 12:52 AM

Digisane
Member

Registered: Jun 2002
Location: By the toilet.
Posts: 174

quote:
Originally posted by BobbyMike
This thread is troll bait

Digisane, they probably have thought twice about what they said. Being closed minded and prejudiced is very mentally taxing.

You're right. It is troll bait. Note however I'm replying to that last sentence alone, all that political stuff said before that is irrelevant to me.

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I'm just a dreamer..

02-28-2003 01:46 PM

EricG
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Registered: Aug 2000
Location: Alive and well on VisorCentral.com
Posts: 861

Please don't feed the troll...

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03-01-2003 07:24 AM

yardie
Member

Registered: Feb 2000
Location:
Posts: 1571

I disagree wholeheartedly! And I agree with much of what Abid had to say. Some Americans are wondering why they are targets by terrorists. What Abid had to say is one of the many reasons why.

It is too easy for those in the West, especially in America, to say that the rest of the world is jealous -- on in Abid's case, a troll. Why not discuss the merit of Abid's arguement? I think it has merit.

quote:
Originally posted by BobbyMike
This thread is troll bait

Digisane, they probably have thought twice about what they said. Being closed minded and prejudiced is very mentally taxing.

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My life is in my Treo... Where is yours?

03-01-2003 05:24 PM

K. Cannon
Member

Registered: Aug 2000
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 1062

quote:
Originally posted by yardie
Why not discuss the merit of Abid's arguement? I think it has merit.

Because we have a somewhat normal discussion on the same topic already going and the people participating over there (incl. you) aren't simply trying to get a rise out of people but seriously discussing their opinions.

03-01-2003 10:22 PM

ToolkiT
VisorCentral Staff

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 1883

quote:
Originally posted by K. Cannon

Because we have a somewhat normal discussion on the same topic already going and the people participating over there (incl. you) aren't simply trying to get a rise out of people but seriously discussing their opinions.

I disagree with that, appart from the last sentence in his post (which I too consider flamebait) he has some points.
I understand that you guys don't agree with those points, fair enough.. but abid's opinion is shared by a lot of non-US people...

Americans can deny these feelings and keep doing what they are doing now.. or they could listen to what others think and explain why they do things their way. I think most of these conflicts are pure misunderstanding... US it trying to do the right thing, but in the process they are creating a lot of 'colleteral damage' and pissing off a lot of people...
By not listening to what other people have to say they are perceived arrogant...

So I agree with Yardie, 'Why not discuss the merit of Abid's arguement? '.

I also hereby give Abid a warning, remarks like the last sentence are flamebait, please refrain from that...

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03-03-2003 02:30 AM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by ToolkiT
I disagree with that, appart from the last sentence in his post (which I too consider flamebait) he has some points. [...]

Considering that all of his points lead _into_ the last sentence, how is it 'flamebait' when the rest are 'valid'? _If_ the US can do whatever it wants without repercussions, and _if_ we're a big bully who everyone fears for our 'irresponsible and selfish actions', then the last sentence is just as 'valid' as the rest of it. OTOH, if the US really can do whatever it wants without repercussions, it seems to me that the world has been let off rather lightly, and really isn't facing much of a terror. Seems to me that this terror is just as irrational and silly as much of the terror talk from the US government.

03-03-2003 12:19 PM

Digisane
Member

Registered: Jun 2002
Location: By the toilet.
Posts: 174

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
Considering that all of his points lead _into_ the last sentence, how is it 'flamebait' when the rest are 'valid'?

Gah, sorry, just had to get into this..

The points lead into the last sentence alright, but if you want the point to get through, you use some other form of writing. It's flamebait because it isn't totally true, and it's also insulting in many ways.

I'm sitting here somewhat worried about going to crowded areas like night clubs or similar places in fear of getting killed in a bomb blast by suicidal terrorist cells, I'm not at all worried about getting killed in a sudden suicidal attack by the American government .

There's a definition to the word 'terror' and it was use incorrectly in that last sentence.

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I'm just a dreamer..

Last edited by Digisane on 03-03-2003 at 02:24 PM

03-03-2003 01:39 PM

Digisane
Member

Registered: Jun 2002
Location: By the toilet.
Posts: 174

--Duplicate----

Last edited by Digisane on 03-03-2003 at 02:19 PM

03-03-2003 01:59 PM

Digisane
Member

Registered: Jun 2002
Location: By the toilet.
Posts: 174

----

__________________
I'm just a dreamer..

Last edited by Digisane on 03-03-2003 at 02:12 PM

03-03-2003 02:02 PM

Abid
Member

Registered: Jan 2003
Location:
Posts: 5

What is terror?

The admonition by TookiT to keep a check on emotional comments is duly noted. Over the past few weeks, I�ve spent time watching CNN and the coverage of the world�s tensions leading up to a potential war with Iraq. This thread was started during a heated moment when I felt that many countries were powerless to charter their own destiny and were subject to the consequences of powered countries pursuing a foreign policy led by selfish interests.

There are a lot of non-Western people who feel this way � that their country�s sovereignty or ability to make independent decisions are compromised by the physical and financial muscle of certain Western countries that often mix economics and politics together to achieve whatever goals they set.

When a country like America owns unimaginable quantities of weapons of mass destruction and un-quantifiably huge financial resources (which are the smartest weapons of mass destruction of all), who is to judge whether selfish decisions made by that country�s politicians or fund managers are any less irresponsible than those of Saddam? With today�s technology, a press of a button by a fund manager or currency speculator can release a financial bomb so powerful it can wipe out a generation of efforts of an entire country leaving it weak and a candidate for financial colonization. How many buttons were pressed before and during the recent Asia currency crisis contagion in the late 90s and who is responsible for the devastation that still lingers on today in many SE Asian countries?

I put it to you that this is the crux of terrorism. The complex web-like nature of political and financial weapons at the disposal of Western countries makes it difficult to point to a single party responsible. And so entire countries are perceived to be responsible �from the politicians, to the fund managers to the innocent people in the streets that benefit from the selfish manipulations of those country�s managers.

When terrorists� emotion of frustration at loosing control and being manipulated overpower their ability to negotiate and �play the game� and there is no clear target � they blindly shoot everywhere and at everything Western. What other option do they have to be heard?

What do the non-Western countries fear more � the chemical weapons in Saddam�s arsenal directed at Western targets or the financial and political smart bombs dropping daily in their countries? One is easy to visualize and the other more subtle. But which one causes more damage? I know which one terrifies me more.

Although not exactly the best site to put forward this discussion, there are some other non-relevant threads here with intelligent comments offered for discussion so I thought what the heck. If America wishes to bomb Asia with Treo smartphones, I would gladly volunteer my country to be a target for technological colonization!

03-03-2003 03:20 PM

Xenoepist
Member

Registered: Sep 2002
Location:
Posts: 19

I am of the opinion that America�s policy has always been of an expansionist nation albeit expansions not of a tangible nature where you can measure land mass and borders, but one of political and economical dependence. To bring opposition to their knees but not with brutal force but with slow arsenic like quality of weakening into servitude.

I cite this example since I am having my breakfast now, I love tangerines always have. They are juicy and delicious, ever wonder why they have no seeds? I have been around the world and have not found a more juicer tangerine then the ones in U.S., and I recall the others always had a lot more of seeds and fiber then juice. Genetic modification I presume - Wow this makes a perfect marketing strategy: give the world a produce that�s unmatchable in its taste BUT cannot be reproduce.

Now Tangerines can be said to be luxury however WHEAT is another ball game, isn�t it. Colonization through food! The thought sure is frightening synonymous with terrifying.

Now off to work

03-03-2003 03:32 PM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by Digisane
Gah, sorry, just had to get into this..

The points lead into the last sentence alright, but if you want the point to get through, you use some other form of writing. It's flamebait because it isn't totally true, and it's also insulting in many ways.

Yes, it is, but that's the point. If any of it is true, it's all true. Even missing the last sentence, it still carries the same point. There are places in the world which hold the same irrational fear of the United States which some of us hold against terrorist threats.

quote:
I'm sitting here somewhat worried about going to crowded areas like night clubs or similar places in fear of getting killed in a bomb blast by suicidal terrorist cells,

Where do you live?

quote:
I'm not at all worried about getting killed in a sudden suicidal attack by the American government .

No, but I'm sure some people do irrationally fear an attack by the US government.

quote:
There's a definition to the word 'terror' and it was use incorrectly in that last sentence.

Yes, the definition of terror is fear. If there are places in the world which really fear an unprovoked attack by the US, they could consider it a 'new terror'. However, as I stated, it's an extremely irrational and unlikely fear. Much in the same way that the Homeland Insecurity deparment feeds irrational fears with warnings to buy duct tape.

03-03-2003 03:47 PM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by Xenoepist
I cite this example since I am having my breakfast now, I love tangerines always have. They are juicy and delicious, ever wonder why they have no seeds? I have been around the world and have not found a more juicer tangerine then the ones in U.S., and I recall the others always had a lot more of seeds and fiber then juice. Genetic modification I presume - Wow this makes a perfect marketing strategy: give the world a produce that�s unmatchable in its taste BUT cannot be reproduce.

Oh, we're truly evil. Takeover through tangerines. Is the rest of the world _that_ easy to defeat? Seems to me that if the US and its arsenal of tangerines is the biggest terror the world has to face, it's in pretty good shape.

03-03-2003 03:51 PM

Xenoepist
Member

Registered: Sep 2002
Location:
Posts: 19

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
Oh, we're truly evil. Takeover through tangerines. Is the rest of the world _that_ easy to defeat? Seems to me that if the US and its arsenal of tangerines is the biggest terror the world has to face, it's in pretty good shape.

Toby I have respect for your logical thinking displayed in most of your posts. I find it odd that of all posters you should selectively edit my post and then choose to respond to it.

03-03-2003 04:04 PM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by Xenoepist
I have respect for your logical thinking displayed in most of your posts. I find it odd that of all posters you should selectively edit my post and then choose to respond to it.

Maybe you should choose a better example next time. I find it ridiculous to accuse the US of economic imperialism and then cite delicious tangerines as a potential mechanism of this. Even if you used wheat, I thought the idea was that we were arrogant because we thought the world couldn't get along without us. Surely if they can, they could get along without our food and goods. Hence the economic imperialism argument seems silly. And if they _can't_ get along without us, then we're not exactly arrogant to think that (assuming we did). That's the weirdest backhanded compliment/conspiracy theory rolled into one I've ever heard.

03-03-2003 04:19 PM

K. Cannon
Member

Registered: Aug 2000
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 1062

Re: What is terror?

quote:
Originally posted by Abid
And so entire countries are perceived to be responsible �from the politicians, to the fund managers to the innocent people in the streets that benefit from the selfish manipulations of those country�s managers.

Where would you have me move so that I can not be perceived as "responsible"? We are capitalists here--our motivation is, largely, money. You would prefer that I move to a country that is not capitalistic? Would that make me less "responsible"? Were citizens of the former USSR not motivated by money? I'm sure the leaders were. If I move to a Muslim country (granted as a female I wouldn't be allowed to participate in any conversations such as this one, work outside the home, or wear shorts in the summer), would that make me "better"?

quote:
What other option do they have to be heard?

I heard Saddam loud and clear when he appeared on 60 Minutes last week. (including the parts where he spoke English, while pretending not to be able to)

quote:
Although not exactly the best site to put forward this discussion, there are some other non-relevant threads here with intelligent comments offered for discussion so I thought what the heck.

I apologize for my statement regarding flamebait, as it is apparent that you were truly interested in starting a dialogue which I believe *should* be addressed. Your original comment was followed up by another potentially "flamey" post and I think that your initial post was perhaps judged by it.

Kelley

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03-03-2003 04:25 PM

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