Registered: Nov 1999
Location: New York, New York
Posts: 560

It is Official: "It's dead Jim"

http://news.com.com/2100-1040-929880.html?tag=fd_top

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Felipe Garcia
Happy Treo 600 user, so far. Thanx Cingular for having an unlocked phone.

My Treo 600 is my phone, my PDA, my watch, and my MP3 player. Oh yeah, I take a picture once in a while with it. Convergence is such a great thing.

Registered: May 2001
Location:
Posts: 70

Ya knew it was coming

I'm going to try to get anther year out of my Prism before upgarding to OS 5, I'll have to keep an eye out for the soon to be deep discount on Memplugs.

Registered: May 2002
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 4

We knew it was coming.

Still, we still have the existing modules, and I don't see anything more we could ask for beyond the VisorPhone and MiniJam.

__________________
Save a tree. Kill a beaver.

Registered: Nov 1999
Location: New York, New York
Posts: 560

quote:

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Originally posted by Mindblade
We knew it was coming.

Still, we still have the existing modules, and I don't see anything more we could ask for beyond the VisorPhone and MiniJam.

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yes we did. and no we can't.

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Felipe Garcia
Happy Treo 600 user, so far. Thanx Cingular for having an unlocked phone.

My Treo 600 is my phone, my PDA, my watch, and my MP3 player. Oh yeah, I take a picture once in a while with it. Convergence is such a great thing.

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:

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Originally posted by Mindblade
We knew it was coming.

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Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 106

Thanks to Handspring for making my decision so easy - I am now the happy owner of an Audiovox Maestro Pocket PC 2002 device. Here's what you get for the price:

1. 16-bit color screen, 32 mb RAM, 1 x SD slot, 1 x CF slot, all the other usual palm-sized software and hardware (PIM, docking, recharge, etc). for $299 - $50 rebate or $249

2. 1 SD Card: 64 MB for $59.99

3. 1 CF Card: 128 MB for $49.99

4. 1 CF 802.11b wireless ethernet card for $119.00

Cost so far: ~$480 which includes:

1. MP3 Player built in (Call it Innogrear ) with 192MB ram
2. Memplug CF
3. Memplug SD

All of which would cost me $900+ if I did it today with Handspring (Prism: $299, 2xMemplugs: $80, same 2 memory cards: $110, 802.11b Springboard: $280, Innogear MP3: $150). Is there any doubt why Handspring is re-thinking their approach?

And before the Handspring defenders (like I was until last week) rise up in protest, my Maestro battery life is comparable to my Prism (i.e. terrible at full bright - 2 or 3 hours, and a day of reasonable use at med bright) and it actually crashes less than my Prism (i.e. only one soft reset required to date after one week except for software installation requirements) which hangs once or twice each day. In addition, I can actually use my Maestro in full sunlight!

I wish the Handspring creators well, but I think their days as a corporate entity are numbered.

Kupe

Registered: Jan 2001
Location: Midwest
Posts: 232

But maybe....

Perhaps what handspring could do is improve their marketting strategies.

The problem with visor/springboards is that you had to buy them seperately. Heck, when you buy a game console these days you at least get a few free games with them. That's because a technology is useless if there is no immediately fun thing you can do with it.

I suggest they keep the Visor line open by:

- eliminating low res monochrome models. Nobody wants one when they see a color model.

- Increase the resolution of their color models to 480x640 or better, 24bit.

- Create targetted BUNDLE packages.

One bundle might be the "Imaging" package. It would include a 1.3 megapixel (or better) springboard camera. The screen would be your viewfinder for the camera. A photo database/editing app, wireless email so you could email any photo taken immediately to family or friend or a photo printing service, etc.. All internal apps would be modified (like eyecontact was a modification of the address book) to include a use for digital images. I can see a use for images as reminders in datebook, memopad, todo list, and so on. You should then be able to send those images via infrared directly to any IR ready photo printer. The camera springboard should have an integrated memory card slot as well. Slip a 128meg smartmedia card in there to store those large picture files. Also include a nice photo editing app for the PC or Mac, so the "Visor Imaging" owner has a way to upload/download photos to the visor, and can edit them on his large screen PC.

Another bundle might be for "Data aquisition". It might include a bar code scanner springboard, a nice database app., removeable media to store individual databases on. You might use it to keep a record of all your media (CDs, DVDs, Vidoe tapes, etc.), inventory your kitchen (scan "out" what you eat, scan "in", what you buy, and have your visor advise you on menus, shopping lists, etc.. Own a small business, say a craft booth? A single visor could be your entire "point of sale" device, replacing cash register, credit card reader, etc.. It could read bar codes on your products, update inventory, calculate sales tax, recommend related accessories, and send all this info to an IR receipt printer (which came in the bundle!). All internal apps would be modified to utilize the database features of this bundle.

One more bundle might be your "diabetes minder". For diabetics it could include a blood sugar analizing springboard. An insulan dose calculator, a pill reminder/scheduler, a medical advisor database with all your critical medical records/info in it, and so on.

Listening, Handspring? Keep the springboard alive, please!


Dave B.

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There is nothing yet made by man that cannot be improved upon.

Registered: Aug 2001
Location: Illinois - not Chicago
Posts: 45

Your talkin' crazy talk !! If normal people (not like us) found out what these springboard-enabled products could do and could get the modules at a reasonable price (bundled) - why, can you imagine the the chaos that would cause? Sales would go up, prices would come down, module developers would flourish and develop better and better modules....it's just insane!! Handspring might actually become a company that people have heard of. No, no - I think the direction for Handspring is to hang thier whole future on a gloirfied cell-phone with no brand reconition, and try to complete with the well established and trusted cell-phone makers. Much safer, and just think - after a little while they won't have to burden themselves with all the trouble of staying in business. Yep, definately the way to go.

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- Don -
"Are you suggesting that coconuts migrate?"

Registered: Sep 2001
Location: MT, USA
Posts: 10

I have to totaly agree with Kupe. I have been a satisfied visor user for many years now, since they came out. and i have a da ton of springboards. I loved my visor, i still do. but about a week ago i was looking to get a new prisim, and well handspring is replacing it with the Treo 90. While i know that i can still order it from Handspring and a lot of other places, why would i want to buy a product on its way out? so i looked at the treo 90, but what is it missing? the springboard. I would have loved to get if it had some way for me to use my springboards. I would have loved it if it would have come with an attachment like the edge, that would have been cool. But i need more then what the treo offers. so then i looked at one of the "true" treo comunicators. but one of my best friends and long time visor user just got the 180 and for some reason handspring is saying the the cd that shiped with the treo must have had a bug b/c her treo didnt fully work out of the box, it had some problems, but it got worse when she synced it. Now her phone book wont open, and it also corputed her backup and her visor. so no phonebook at all on any of 3 machines thanks to handspring. Handspring support is still working on the issue, but now they are waiting for a responce from Microsoft to see how to fix it.

So on monday, i went and bought a Compaq iPaq 3800 and i have to say right out of the box i love it. Since i use outlook all i had to do was install active sync, and then sync the device. and poof, it even transfered my avantgo account automaticly. So here is how i look at it:
Ipaq: $600
129 MB SD card: $50
Cable to my vell phone: $60
Voice Recorder: Included
MP3 player: Included
Veido Player: Included
Audible Player: Included
SD card slot: Included
Pocket office: Included
LOTS OF SOFTWARE (that i bought for the palm came free with the ipaq)
Plus a lot of other cool features.

So why is it beter: It has most all the functions that i had on the visor, but they are all in a case the same size, no modules to carry or switch. and the transition was so easy i didnt even notice it. Handspring needs to do somthing. and with the treo, that is not the best either: 1) it is not expandable, 2) for a little bit more money, you can get a pocket PC with a ton of features (none of witch come, or are even availble for the treo) and get a cable to your cell phone and your off on the web, email (you dont need treo mail).Plus it is color NOW, and you dont need an adition phone account, i can still carry my small little phone with me and i dont need a bulky orgnizer in my pocket just for a phone.
If you dont want to use your existing phone, just get an air card and the expansion pack and you can get online with virtualy ANY provider in the world, your not locked in to 2 companies you can use any.
So i hate to say that i am not a huge far of the visor anymore, it accualy kinda hurts, but i am not going to sit around and wait to see if handspring comes back around.

Registered: Sep 2001
Location: MT, USA
Posts: 10

Ok, so after my long rant, i do have to say that i do love the visor, and now i am seriously looking at getting a new visor edge (befor they go) WHY? Well i love palm OS and the visor, and the comapq is a little bigger then my visor, i have a lot of spring boards (however i ralyy dont see using them all the often) ant the size is what is apealing. I dnt allways need my compaq and all its features. so for some times the edge would be great, as a back up, and when i need somthing small that either isnt going to rip off my pocket, or i can through it in my coat pocket when i am out and no one will know.

Registered: Apr 2001
Location: Des Moines, IA
Posts: 248

I actually left the visor line a few months back. Went to a Maestro, and then ditched that for a Handera 330.

Now I've got a N760C (bought new a couple weeks ago). Couldn't be happier. Didn't want the flip screen on th NR-70, or the price tag. $250.00, brand new, not refurb'd.

I think you're going to be disappointed with the 3800 series. (Not PPC in general) here's why:

Online Petition to Compaq/HP to recall the 3800

They have tons of issues...non-functional bluetooth (maybe fixed by now), SD card interface is slowed by a design flaw. So slow I think people have issues running movies, and even some apps.

Read all the issues for yourself. If you don't get to fancy with it, it'll serve you well.

I personally think the Toshiba e570 is the way to go. The Casio had big time issues with it as well. BTW...the battery life on the Toshiba/Maestro wasn't nearly as bad as everyone claimed...it was absolutely usable. The e310 is very nice too!

Good luck!

Registered: Jun 2002
Location: 3rd planet, Solar System
Posts: 112

I'm new to this forum but I'm a LOOONG time PDA user - hell I still have my Sharp Wizard OZ-8200!!! I started using the Palm OS back when it was called the Pilot - I still have a Pilot 5000 that's been upgraded to IR. I also have 2 older Windows CE products - an LG Phenom featuring Windows CE 3.0 (big thing with keyboard) and a Philips Nino - the first venture into HPC for Windows. Right now I'm using a Handspring Platinum and have been for more than a year and a half - I have worked with the iPaq on many occasions because some execs in my company use them.

What I'm trying to get at is that I've used a WIDE variety of PDAs. It is my opinion that ANY operating system that includes an hour glass for processing data is waaay too slow to run on a handheld! It takes 200+Mhz processor to run windows CE - Palm OS runs fine on 16, better on 33 and now with the new Sonys it's screaming at 66mhz! Memory management on the Palm is MUCH better - perhaps because it's simpler OS, perhaps because it's better written. What I don't understand is why some people here are saying - well I hope my Prism lasts me for another year... I just don't get it!!! Exactly HOW are you outgroing the Prism is BEYOND me... I know that memory could have been greater out of the box but as far as functionality goes - it doesn't get any better than Palm OS! I think people just get bored with their toys and that's why they move on, NOT because the device is not functional any more... A move to HPC is a move in the wrong direction IMO. The application base for Palm OS is about 3:1 greater than for WinCE and there is a LOT more freeware for the palm! I believe that Handspring is taking a wrong turn by getting away from the springboard module - they could have made an adapter for the Treo like on the Edge to retain some customer base (people who spend a couple of hundred $$$ on upgrades are not very happy to buy a new product from the same company that does not use them...) I think that Handspring should have gone both ways - design the adapter for the Treo to take springboards and a spring board adapter to take SD/IO - they could have made EVERYBODY happy by doing so...

For what it's worth I have just purchased a Prism from E-bay ($160 shipped) and I already have the MiniJam w/64mb ($60 shipped) as well as the Targus cam ($75 shipped)... I think that I'll stick with the Visor line and enjoy the new lowered prices (clearance pricing rules!). Who knows - I might pickup a GPS and a GSM phone while I'm at it . As I stated earlier - I still have my Pilot 5000 (now with cool 2mb and IR :-O )which I can always drop in the cradle and sync on the spot. I don't see why I wouldn't be able to do so with my Prism in the next 3-4 years.

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 106

quote:

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Originally posted by Gambit
[B]I'm new to this forum but I'm a LOOONG time PDA user - hell I still have my Sharp Wizard OZ-8200!!!

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Casio B.O.S.S. - gotcha beat

quote:

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What I'm trying to get at is that I've used a WIDE variety of PDAs. It is my opinion that ANY operating system that includes an hour glass for processing data is waaay too slow to run on a handheld!

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And the days are numbered for any operating system that can only do one thing at a time and needs to task switch.

quote:

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It takes 200+Mhz processor to run windows CE - Palm OS runs fine on 16, better on 33 and now with the new Sonys it's screaming at 66mhz!

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With this logic, you must still be using MS-DOS 3.22 and an 8 MHz 8088. The ARM processors are price competitive with the Dragonballs - why not take the faster of the two? Palm is finally seeing the light on this issue - maybe you should too.

quote:

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Memory management on the Palm is MUCH better - perhaps because it's simpler OS, perhaps because it's better written.

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True enough - but then again memory management is a much simpler issue with a single-thread, task-switching operating system.

quote:

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. . . as far as functionality goes - it doesn't get any better than Palm OS!

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Unless you want:
- Out of the box MP3
- Out of the box POP3 email
- Out of the box email attachments
- Out of the box MS compatible spreadsheet
- Out of the box MS compatible word processing
- Out of the box memory expansion
- $100 WiFi upgrade
- $100 Bluetooth upgrade
- $75 memory increase by 256 mb
- etc, etc, etc

I outgrew phonebook and calendar only devices with my HP100LX back in 1990. It took Palm a long time to reach a level useful to me (with considerable shortfalls) - PPC, with their 2002 version, has simply passed Palm up with their price/performance.

quote:

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I think people just get bored with their toys and that's why they move on, NOT because the device is not functional any more... A move to HPC is a move in the wrong direction IMO.

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One I don't share - but the point is assuredly arguable.

quote:

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The application base for Palm OS is about 3:1 greater than for WinCE and there is a LOT more freeware for the palm!

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More like 10:1 in my experience, but USEFUL programs is more like 1.5 to 1. I mean, how many weekly views do you need on your calendar? How many "Today"-like programs do you need (originally brought to you by PPC! )? Does the palm community really need 9 email programs?

quote:

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I believe that Handspring is taking a wrong turn by getting away from the springboard module - they could have made an adapter for the Treo like on the Edge to retain some customer base (people who spend a couple of hundred $$$ on upgrades are not very happy to buy a new product from the same company that does not use them...)

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BINGO! Not only did this drive me away from Handspring, but it got me seriously looking at PPC for the first time ever. Now I am a convert - and I gave up nothing in the switch to PPC, but gained a whole lot . . for a lower price.

Kupe

Registered: Jun 2002
Location: 3rd planet, Solar System
Posts: 112

To answer several questions - no - I'm not using DOS 3.2 on an 8088 But as far as single thread vs multi thread OS goes - IT'S PALM SIZED extension to a multithreaded OS - doesn't NEED to be multithreaded to be effective - The simple fact that Palm OS has lived through 3 revisions of Windows CE and 3 revisions of Windows CE for HPCs proves that better than anything else! To me Windows CE is imperfect solution to a badly defined problem. Microsoft set out to make windows in your palm - well they failed as far as that goes. The CE interface has very little to do with a true Windows Interface (it was pretty close when they had the keyboard design) and the exact multithreading (multitasking?) that you support is what brings the system to its knees - before you know it you have 6 applications open using the MAXIMUM amount of allowed RAM and everything is draging. It's amazing how many times I've had to go to someone's desk and show them that they can't have pWord, pExcel, pOutlook and pIE open at the same time while trying to play a video - just won't work!

As for built in support goes - MiniJam player can be had for $60 (and it inlcudes ~1mb of flash onboard), POP3 mail support, word/excel spreadsheet can be had for under $40 (pop3 can be had for free) Memory expension is available - $40 and you can plug in a CF card and have all the memory in the world - but that's another PLUS for the Palm OS - average application only takes 100-300k MAX. Try finding a desent WinCE application that's under a meg... And as far as usefullness - There's a lot of junky software titles out there but there is just as many useful programs - and a wide variety of them - if you are in just about ANY professional field out there - you'll find at least a dozen applications that you can use at your work.

Oh - and as for the B.O.S.S. - it can be argued which one came first (I said I have the OZ8200 - in reallity my first PDA was the OZ-7000 - first PDA with a silk screen for the expansion IC cards)
All I have to say is - different strokes for different folks