Registered: Jan 2001
Location:
Posts: 278

Ok, so it seems this id card is just building on your social security card. It is the same idea in a way. This is not to say that I truely support the idea. Most people either have driver lisences or passports. What good would this id card do against terrorist attacks because unless they were U.S. citizens they wouldn't have a card. This reminds me too much of high school.

--David

Registered: Dec 1999
Location: "Children are a gift from God, they are a reward"
Posts: 1049

A national ID card is dumb because no matter how they design it criminals or terrorists will be able to make fake ones. I certainly don't need another ID. I think that certainly some pin head will try to run a bill through, but politicians rarely ever actually want to make effective laws. (and I agree with you KC, that someone will try that)

Larry Ellison is a self serving idiot child(I'm sure his stockholders wouldn't agree with me). Why doesn't he use his vast intellect to figure out a system that we could use to track what happens to socks in the washer/dryer? Or use it to design a credit card that will only work for the proper user?

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Registered: Jun 2000
Location: Irving, TX
Posts: 21

quote:

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Originally posted by BobbyMike
A national ID card is dumb because no matter how they design it criminals or terrorists will be able to make fake ones.

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Also consider this, I heard it on Politically Incorrect (I was flipping channels when he said this and it caught my attention), they were talking about the national ID card thing. Bill said something to effect of that the terrorists had valid state drivers licenses, but Jenna Bush had a fake one to get beer.

quote:

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Originally posted by GSR13
The biggest difference to me is the fact that a DL is voluntary. Not only that, it is not something you get at birth and are told to keep with you at all times, which this probably would do.

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According to this http://www0.mercurycenter.com/local/center/id101701.htm Larry Ellison says the card would be voluntary for US citizens. But then that is just his opinion, it could be implemented in a variaty of ways.


Also check out this mock-up of the ID card... http://www.templetons.com/brad/oracard.html

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Registered: Aug 2000
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 1062

quote:

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Originally posted by BobbyMike
Why doesn't he use his vast intellect to figure out a system that we could use to track what happens to socks in the washer/dryer?

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Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:

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Originally posted by BobbyMike
A national ID card is dumb because no matter how they design it criminals or terrorists will be able to make fake ones.

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Registered: Dec 1999
Location: "Children are a gift from God, they are a reward"
Posts: 1049

"heh...because he doesn't really have a vast intellect? At best, he has an exercised, focused one. Vast implies wide of purpose and well-rounded to me."

My use of vast was meant sarcastically, I forgot to add the appropriate smiley .

"That's the problem, though. This wouldn't be an effective law."

Exactly my point....

Maybe Al Gore could help him out on this one. If they wanted it to be a bi-partisan effort they could ask Jesse Helms to help out.

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"I am a debtor both to Greeks and to Barbarians, both to the wise and to the foolish."

Registered: Mar 2001
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 26

If I wanted to live in a place where they have National ID cards I'd move there. Implementing them in the "land of the free" is TOTALLY the wrong idea. I can deal with fingerprint scanning at the DMV (though I know a LOT of people who were upset with that) but national IDs is just crazy to me.

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Registered: Oct 2000
Location:
Posts: 61

I've been roofing a house for the last few days and haven't had a chance to post til now.

Just for the record. My post from earlier about the chips, I was being humorous but I was deadly serious. Technology is already there and being used in pets. With a little more development.......

Also the GPS on a chip may come later but for now they are starting to track us by our cell phones. Infrastructure is behind the government deadlines but won't stay that way long. If it can be used for just 911 calls now it could be used to slowly provide services and always the government COULD eavesdrop and tell where you placed that call from.

Of course this only keeps track of the decent people and stupid criminals. The smart ones will still find ways to circumvent the authorities.

Of course, even if we stop carrying cell phones, credit cards, atms, internet, etc. We could still be monitored by the super small robotic insects! Another 10 years and they could drop a load of robotic butterflies over a city and watch the population. Once again humorous but if you spend any amount of time watching the discovery channel you'll see this stuff all the time.

And if it took 10 years for the government to acknowledge the existence of the stealth figther just imagine what some black ops project is working on. People shouldn't get paranoid. Just be aware.

Registered: Dec 1999
Location:
Posts: 239

Well, it looks like the government may not be going for it..........yet. At least, that's what they're telling us.

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Registered: Mar 2001
Location: Out of my skull, back in five minutes
Posts: 1435

from the article:

quote:

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Despite those concerns, Oracle's Ellison was the first to push ID cards, suggesting that his company's database software should be used. Sun Microsystems CEO Scott McNealy was next, and earlier Wednesday, Siebel Systems announced "Homeland Security" software.

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Registered: Dec 2000
Location: Petersburg, AK
Posts: 131

I have not given it much thought but I think it might be wise to consolidate all these cards I'm carrying anyway. Give me one card that lets me vote, travel (drive or get on an airplane), hunt, fish, carry/own a firearm, Social Security number... It seems that by consolidating information and using current technology that I could change my voter registration at some website, and have a database instantly update so when I go to the polls and my card is scanned then the gadget checks the daatabase and shows me as a resident. Likewise the Fish & Game official could use his portable device to check my hunting license and see if I have registered for the mountain goat permit or if my uzi is registered.

Go ahead and hit me with all the big brother comments. Or anti-gun-registration stuff. Just off the top of my head I think that these kinds of updates to our systems would be nice.

Registered: Aug 2000
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 1062

And Notary Public, don't forget that...

Registered: Feb 2001
Location: Kingston
Posts: 15

quote:

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Originally posted by briker206
Another 10 years and they could drop a load of robotic butterflies over a city and watch the population.

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Registered: Mar 2001
Location: Nebraska- the Good life
Posts: 695

IF they ever offered a National ID Card, you KNOW it would almost HAVE to be implanted somehow or else it would just cause the same old problems with loss, forgeries, theft, etc.

I KNOW there are problems- hacking, identity theft, etc., but I also think there COULD be a huge social improvement IF it could be done right (yeah, I know, 'government' and 'done right' don't mix!)

Our society is afraid. We are bringing our kids up to be sheltered and afraid. We are afraid of abductions- even though the rates of abductions by strangers has not changed significantly (abductions by relatives, however, were WAY up). We are afraid of sexual molesters in our neighborhoods, of convicted pushers and other criminals, of weapons at school, of gangs, etc.

If we BELIEVED that such a card/chip could help protect us, I think we as a society would take a deep breath and slowly relax back to a healthier level.

If an ex-spouse swiped my child, both the abductor and my child would have the chip- and would have to use it eventually (for a job, to go to school, to buy on credit, when pulled over by the police, to pay taxes, whatever) and thus be located.

Many of our other concerns, as a society, would be simialrly relieved. Dead-beat dad? He's right here. Escaped felon? Over here. Would the card/chip heal in reality? Probably not- but the perceptions is, as we all know, far more important than reality!

On the other hand- I REALLY doubt we could/would do it right!