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Posted by jeff318 on 02-20-2002 11:13 PM:

Laptop

Okay... I am an 8th grade student and web designer. I would like my dad to ALLOW me to purchase a laptop. I am not asking for him to buy it, but he is still being very stubborn. My mom is okay with the idea, but dad still gives a no... saying that it wouldn't be worthwhile. This is not a teenaged "spur-of the-moment" want, either. It has been over a year since I first asked, and over four months since I began actively pursuing it. After he told me that he was annoyed with my pestering him, I "toned it down" to a level he could tolerate, but he still won't budge.

Please give me reasons that I could give for me to get a laptop.

Thanks a lot,
Jeff

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Posted by Yorick on 02-21-2002 02:59 AM:

Well, first of all, do you (or your family) already have more than one computer? That could be a stumbling block. (One I don't know how you could get around. There was a time where my family had five computers.)
He also could be balking at price. find a decent used one and see if you can talk to him about that one.
Does your school allow laptops? if so, you could use the "it'll help my edumacation" tactic.
Of course, the second you say anything about wanting to use it for games, you're sunk deeper than the Marianas Trench.

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Posted by RSGMOOSE on 02-21-2002 03:42 AM:

If you are a web designer!

Tell your dad it will save on system resources for the "home" computer and allow your other siblings time on the "home" computer while your web designing elsewhere.

Now, the other advantage is to aid you in web design and allow you some additional income by having a portable computer that you can take with you on site to properly complete your web designs.

Also, go the next step and explain that you'll pay for insurance and anti-theft equipment as well as allow Dad to check your system out from time to time to be certain that you aren't surfing any undesirable sites that parents don't want their adolescent kids seeing. This last statement might seem like an invasion of your privacy but it might be part of the stumbling block that you have to overcome.

Parents want to know what their 12 and 13 year old kids are doing at all times.....and rightfully so.

If that doesn't do it then make an appointment with your father to discuss this issue and allow him to tell you his concerns about the issue. Don't try and discuss it with him unless you've made the appointment.....this is how my kids, 16 and 10, have been instructed to get my attention without interruption.

Good luck!

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Posted by dick-richardson on 02-21-2002 05:44 AM:

tic

Tell your dad to butt out. It's your life and you'll live it how you damn well please. Tell him a young man needs to explore his sexuality on his own terms (which is why you really want it, isn't it?).

[yoda-voice]Curious you are.[/yoda-voice]

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Posted by yardie on 02-21-2002 04:37 PM:

Re: tic

Oh No Dick! This one takes the cake ... I hope you aint serious.

Anyhow I for one agree with his father. What the hell is an 8th grader doing with a laptop? I didn't even know what a computer looks like when I was in 8th grade! You can get one when you reach 16..at least that what I would say if I was your father.

quote:
Originally posted by dick-richardson
Tell your dad to butt out. It's your life and you'll live it how you damn well please. Tell him a young man needs to explore his sexuality on his own terms (which is why you really want it, isn't it?).

[yoda-voice]Curious you are.[/yoda-voice]

Posted by septimus on 02-21-2002 04:44 PM:

Bah. I'm with D-R, serious or joking.

Sounds to me like you've got an impossible task, because your dad has cleverly placed the burden of proof on you. don't take that. Ask him "why not," carefully take note of his answer, and post it/them here. We'll knock them down.

"Not worthwhile."
--As in, "too expensive"?--it sounds to me like it's not his money. If he trusts you enough to allow you to earn money or receive an allowance, he has to take the consequences that you'll spend it as you please.
--As in "not worth the pain of worrying about you having a computer." Well, that a separate issue, isn't it. and it requires its own "why not."

Again, ask "why not," and don't be whiny about it. And take his answers deadly serious by taking time to come up with good and full refutations. Continue this tactic with slow deliberation and seriousness.

...that's how I got my playboy! (just kidding! just kidding!)

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Posted by dick-richardson on 02-21-2002 05:23 PM:

Re: Re: tic

quote:
Originally posted by yardie
Oh No Dick! This one takes the cake ... I hope you aint serious.

Not in the least.

quote:
Originally posted by Diet R. Bohn
Bah. I'm with D-R, serious or joking.

What you proposed (and with which I agree, more or less) is entirely unlike what I told him to do.

If your dad's buying it, you don't need it. If you're buying it, your dad needs to allow you to screw up (as he sees it), for how else will you learn? Big Chief knows kids are unable to learn by instruction.

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Posted by septimus on 02-21-2002 05:37 PM:

Re: Re: Re: tic

quote:
Originally posted by dick-richardson
What you proposed (and with which I agree, more or less) is entirely unlike what I told him to do.

Right. I know. I knew. I will know...

given the odd nature of his pa's refusal, I just thought perhaps jumping to "butt out" might not work--more of a last step "so, now that we've shown that you have no good reason to keep me from buying a laptop, butt out" than a first step "Butt out. You have no good reason to keep me from buying a laptop".

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Posted by Toby on 02-21-2002 06:22 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by dietrichbohn
[...] Sounds to me like you've got an impossible task, because your dad has cleverly placed the burden of proof on you.

Shirley, you're joking.

quote:
don't take that.

Why not?

quote:
Ask him "why not," carefully take note of his answer, and post it/them here. We'll knock them down.

heh heh heh

quote:
"Not worthwhile."
--As in, "too expensive"?--it sounds to me like it's not his money. If he trusts you enough to allow you to earn money or receive an allowance, he has to take the consequences that you'll spend it as you please.

Newsflash: unless he's an emancipated minor, no, the father doesn't.

quote:
Again, ask "why not," and don't be whiny about it. And take his answers deadly serious by taking time to come up with good and full refutations. Continue this tactic with slow deliberation and seriousness. [...]

I wouldn't advise this path. This way, there be tygers. The burden of proof _is_ on him. He wants the laptop, and the responsible adult thinks the decision is unwise (and his decision is the one that counts regardless of how well it's supported). He must come up with a convincing argument to support what he wants. Yes, 'because I said so' is a weak parental argument, but ultimately, it's an effective one on someone who has no choice but to accept it. Personally, I think the father has presented his offspring with a very good learning experience. When one gets into 'the real world' one has to make these sorts of cases all the time. What exactly do you want the laptop for? Are you paying for it? What's the opportunity cost (what other things might you lose by spending this money this way, e.g. money towards college tuition, down payment on a car in a few years, etc.)? You say that you do web development. Will having this laptop increase your earning potential and perhaps recoup the money spent in short order? Will the consequences of having it affect your school work? IOW, even if it pays for itself, will your having it and earning money with it have a negative impact on the time you spend on school work? Same two questions WRT social life.

Posted by dick-richardson on 02-21-2002 08:09 PM:

Toby, a couple short years ago I would've considered your arguments unpassioned and uninspired. I would've thought them counterproductive and overprotective.

Then I had a son...

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Posted by Toby on 02-21-2002 09:03 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by dick-richardson
Toby, a couple short years ago I would've considered your arguments unpassioned and uninspired. I would've thought them counterproductive and overprotective.

Then I had a son...

heh...that's like the old salt about "When I was xx, I thought my father was a complete idiot. When I turned xx, I was amazed at how much he had learned in those short years."

Posted by dick-richardson on 02-21-2002 10:26 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
heh...that's like the old salt about "When I was xx, I thought my father was a complete idiot. When I turned xx, I was amazed at how much he had learned in those short years."

A quote usually attributed to Mark Twain.

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Posted by Toby on 02-21-2002 10:28 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by dick-richardson
A quote usually attributed to Mark Twain.

heh...well I was paraphrasing because I couldn't remember the exact wording usually attributed to ol' Sam Clemens.

Posted by BobbyMike on 02-21-2002 11:57 PM:

"heh...well I was paraphrasing because I couldn't remember the exact wording usually attributed to ol' Sam Clemens."

The first thing to go is your memory, and the second thing is ... is....

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Posted by yardie on 02-22-2002 03:59 PM:

Viagra

Viagra anyone? Or am I way off base here?

quote:
Originally posted by BobbyMike
"heh...well I was paraphrasing because I couldn't remember the exact wording usually attributed to ol' Sam Clemens."

The first thing to go is your memory, and the second thing is ... is....

Posted by Yorick on 02-22-2002 05:22 PM:

Re: Viagra

Originally posted by yardie
Viagra anyone? Or am I way off base here?

All your base ... ah, never mind.

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Posted by foo fighter on 02-22-2002 05:39 PM:

Hmm, Laptops...sexuality...aging/memory loss...Viagra...Samuel Clemens...

Yeah, I see the connection. Another classic VC discussion trails off into never never land.

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Posted by Toby on 02-22-2002 05:44 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by foo fighter
Hmm, Laptops...sexuality...aging/memory loss...Viagra...Samuel Clemens...

Yeah, I see the connection. Another classic VC discussion trails off into never never land.

And this too shall pass...

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