VisorCentral.com - The long wait

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VisorCentral.com (http://discussion.visorcentral.com/vcforum/index.php)
- Visor Edge (http://discussion.visorcentral.com/vcforum/forumdisplay.php?forumid=25)
-- The long wait (http://discussion.visorcentral.com/vcforum/showthread.php?threadid=13324)

Posted by kscat on 03-22-2001 02:27 AM:

Posted by Sean Li on 03-22-2001 10:23 AM:

I'm pretty sure that Palm's pre-announcement was due, in part, to Handspring releasing the Visor Edge - the "thin" form factor is obviously very important, as I'm sure Palm knows from sales of the Palm V. The timing of the announcement is bound to have an impact on sales of the Visor Edge. It was also probably in part due to the timing of CeBIT.

You can order an Edge now from the Handspring store, and I understand that it's starting to show up in retail stores. You can only pre-order the Palm M50x, which won't ship for several weeks.

I got a Visor Edge earlier this week; ordered it the day after the announcement. The stylus is slightly loose, but doesn't rattle unless you shake it and listen for it - I certainly wouldn't have noticed it until it was pointed out on other message boards. I prefer the overall design of the Edge, and I'm pretty sure that Handspring will eventually have a color version, and I wouldn't be surprised if the release of the color version coincided with the early shipments of Palm M505s

Coming back to your original point though, companies generally tend to announce products early. Even if they say they're shipping, it takes a while before they reach the sales channels. Also, we have much faster communication channels now (i.e. internet/web/email), and are aware of new products much sooner than before. Product lifecycles in technology are also extremely short, all of which affects demand for products. I'm not suggesting any solutions to this, it's merely an observation.

Posted by JAFischel on 03-22-2001 10:49 AM:

They sure didn't miss mark...

I ordered my Edge Tuesday of last week and had it on Thursday afternoon when I got home from work. Just order it direct from Handspring. As far as Palm saying they have a new unit but you can't have it for a month - I have to agree that it was like fighting fire with matches. That is, they wanted to take away some of Handspring's thunder. The thing is, most Mac users don't bother with 3COM units because of potential of having to shell out extra bucks for extra stuff to make the unit work with their computer system.

-Josh

Posted by critic on 03-22-2001 02:00 PM:

Re: They sure didn't miss mark...

quote:
Originally posted by JAFischel
I ordered my Edge Tuesday of last week and had it on Thursday afternoon when I got home from work. Just order it direct from Handspring. As far as Palm saying they have a new unit but you can't have it for a month - I have to agree that it was like fighting fire with matches. That is, they wanted to take away some of Handspring's thunder. The thing is, most Mac users don't bother with 3COM units because of potential of having to shell out extra bucks for extra stuff to make the unit work with their computer system.

To be fair, though, Palm has made good to Mac users with the m50X series by providing USB connectivity and Mac software in the box...which, come to think of it, takes away another of Handspring's selling points. But you're right that Palm has burned quite a few bridges with Mac users by asking them to shell out an additional $25 for a serial connector and a CD Rom for all those years.

As for me, I'm sticking with my Prism for now. I wouldn't jump back to Palm until this SD/MMC card is tested and proven, and the selection of expansion modules/sleds/whatever matches the selection for Visor.

Posted by b1lanceman on 03-23-2001 02:42 AM:

Alot of that was because the m50x series is targeted at corporate buyers. And it takes a while for the corporate beauracracy to get done to order a section of a company a whole new kind of palm.

Remember, alot of that wasn't to kill visor edge. Palm makes money off every handheld that Hanspring sells.

Posted by Toby on 03-23-2001 03:35 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by kscat
Just curious as to what people think about companies introducing a product and then waiting a few weeks to make it avaible. Why announce it if someone can't go to the store that day and buy it. When the Edge came out I rushed to my piggy bank to start rolling pennies, but going to the retail stores there wasn't even a fake model to look at. The next day or so I was having visions of edge in my head.

Monday, Palm introduced the new M5xx series. That coupled with some of the reports about rattling stylus (can't stand rattling) have made me start looking at the Palm.

So anyway what I'm trying to say is that Handspring missed out on my buisness by not having product availble in the stores. I may not buy the Palm either, but it would be nice to actually be able to hold one of these to decide. Since both are not avaible maybe they both lost out.

Lemme get this straight: You're upset because a company announces a product which you can buy directly immediately at announcement time, and is already available in some stores less than a week later and should be available in all existing retailers by the end of the month (they _do_ have ordering and shipping issues which differ from chain to chain after all), and to show this displeasure, you're considering buying from a company which announces a product in mid-March which won't be shipping until mid-May and may not be in stores until the end of that month?

Posted by kscat on 03-24-2001 03:02 AM:

Toby has no balls

Posted by MbassadorK on 03-24-2001 04:01 AM:

I'm sorry, but didn't Handspring say they would be available in stores by the end of the month? I think that they are in a few stores more than a week before the end of the month is sorta keeping their word.

We have to wait to see if Palm is correct about the date they said their product would be available...

Posted by bkbk on 03-25-2001 12:34 PM:

I played w/the Edge at a Staples in NYC the other day (Thurs., I think).
I guess I should have posted some kind of note about it, but it didn't occur to me. (We're really spoiled here, routinely getting items like 4 seconds after they were invented, even if it was in Japan, Katmandu, Cairo -- whatever.)

Anyway, I was pretty impressed, overall. DEFINITELY faster than ANY Palm O.S. device I've ever seen. (I guess they cut more wait states to beat the Plat?)
Heavier than I'd've thought, but not, say, more than my HSVD. (Felt like maybe 2/3rds its weight.) I liked it's weight, which I thought made it feel more substantial.

It is LOUDER, too, than any Palm O.S. device I've ever seen / held, etc. It went into "Quick Addr." mode somehow (I only fooled w/it for under a min., as the salesguy was waiting to put it back in the glass case.), and bleeped a lot when I scrolled up & down (and there were 'natch, "no more entries"), so it was easy to tell.

Screen seemed just like the others (not grayer / lighter, as some reports have had it) -- though I didn't really look for this. As I left the store, though, it flashed on me that I'd've noticed if it was.

I think a lot of people are right who've posted about the timing of the Edge, etc. (and I guess Palm wanting to steal thunder w/the M50x devices); still, I can't see anyone buying an Edge today (if they can't/won't wait a mo.) feeling "ripped off."

__________________
"Great Spirits Have Always Encountered Violent Opposition From Mediocre Minds." -- Albert Einstein

Posted by Intysoft on 03-25-2001 02:29 PM:

EDGE IN STORE!!

Front page of Office Max flyer TODAY!!!

__________________
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TreoCentral.com
Product Page Editor

Posted by Toby on 03-26-2001 01:48 PM:

Re: RE

quote:
Originally posted by kscat
That's right Toby!

You obviously have some kind of irrational axe to grind with Handspring then, because that position makes no logical sense.

quote:
In fact I was out in the stores again today and guess what, Still no Edge to be seen.

What part of "by the end of the month" didn't you understand?

quote:
Palm at least told us it would be a month before they would be available.

So did Handspring...

quote:
Available immediately in three metallic colors at Handspring.com, and in select retail stores across North America and English-speaking regions throughout the world by the end of the month, Visor Edge will sell for U.S. $399. Availability of colors may vary at retail stores.

It's not the end of the month yet.

quote:
Beleive it or not, everyone doesn't just order right off the web.

I believe it quite easily. Nothing that I said remotely suggested otherwise.

quote:
I would rather see and feel before I buy.

That's what makes no sense about your position. You should be able to see (and buy if you're so inclined) a Visor Edge within three weeks of announcement. You won't be able to see an M500 in stores until probably a month from now, and an M505 until mid-May. Handspring should look pretty good in comparison from a purely announcement/retail availability standpoint.

quote:
But hey, I'm not upset.

If you say so. You still seem to have an irrational prejudice against Handspring WRT Palm.

quote:
Instead of wasting my money on an Edge which I would have done, I'll be getting a color m505.

Yeah, that's the one that was announced last week and won't be available for at least a month and a half. Have you figured out what about your statement doesn't make any sense yet?

quote:
At least I know when to expect the 505,

No, actually you don't. You know when it's scheduled to be available. Individual chain stores will still have to deal with their own internal ordering systems. You also don't know how well they will sell compared to Palm's manufacturing capacity for them.

quote:
who knows how long it will take handspring to deal with their shipping and supply issues.

Well, everyone who has ordered one directly from Handspring seems to have received theirs in short order, so it seems that so far Handspring has no shipping or supply issues. Chain stores have their own timetables to deal with, which is why Handspring stated that retail availability would be "by the end of the month".

All of this aside, if you want to wait for an M505, that's your prerogative. They seem rather interesting, and I'd definitely check one out when they're available in stores. However, your reasons for discounting the Edge seem rather irrational and senseless, and come off as trying to justify making a decision that really doesn't need justification. If you don't want an Edge, don't get one. If you want an M505, get one. What's the point in bringing up phantom issues that apply more to your apparent choice than the choice you don't want?

Posted by kscat on 03-27-2001 02:26 AM:

Posted by RSGMOOSE on 03-27-2001 04:38 AM:

Unvailing and Not Shipping

Ok,

For those of us that originally bought a Deluxe on 9/14/99 and didn't receive their unit until October 25th, the practice of unvailing and not shipping is nothing new.

Palm without a doubt was trying to stave off those people that were on a "fence" about buying a PDA. However, the scheduled press release was delayed to some degrees to give the M105 it's two weeks in the sun. Palm simply didn't want to overshadow the release of the M105 with another platform.

The iPaq was pre-released, as were all of the other Win CE machines last year.

There is no crime in pre-release and when it comes to Handspring and all of the various springboard module people, everyone of the pre-released the product before shipping in so many instances it's not funny.

The real coup would be if Handspring were to release a color version, and ship, before Palm can get the M505 to market then they might get me back. I sold my Prism because of form factor and I believe that because of the SD form factor will allow Palm to hold their market share over Handspring. Especially, since Handspring has potential changed the Springboard slot.

Hold on cause the ride is about to get bumpy....ok it's been bumpy for a year and half ever since Handspring launched.

__________________
Moose Man
I may be from the LEFT coast but that's not the correct political view in my mind!

Posted by Toby on 03-27-2001 12:35 PM:

Re: RE

quote:
Originally posted by kscat
Hah, I was using senseless logic.

That makes about as much sense as the rest of it.

quote:
Would that be the beginning of the end, the middle of the end or the end of the end?

I'll take the smartass response as an admission that even you realize your position was ridiculous.

quote:
Dohhh. Got me there.

Amazing how these "fact" things work to back up assertions.

quote:
Oh not this again.

Well, I thought it was a bit redundant, but I thought it might help it sink in.

quote:
But it was the undertones!

Any undertones you read were all in your head. I mentioned both online and real world sales..

quote:
Anyway, My real meaning of my post(guess I didn't get my point across) was how much damage it does to a company if their product is not avaiable(in store) at the time of anouncement. I was trying to show how by not having it avaible(in stores), one might loose out on buisness. IOW, how many impulse sales are lost.

Your point would have been much more effective had you not picked a worse example of the practice that you were trying to decry as how a business should conduct itself. IOW, don't criticize the man who's drunk all the time by pointing out a man who's been drinking more and for longer as the role model. Of course, your point would have also been much more effective were it reasonable to be upset about it. The Edge announcement on Handspring's part, when taken in the context of the industry which it's in, was as close to perfect as you're going to get. They obviously learned their lesson when they had their original shipping and production issues and have come as close to eliminating them as anyone in the industry ever gets.

Posted by kscat on 03-27-2001 01:17 PM:

Posted by kscat on 03-27-2001 01:32 PM:

Posted by Toby on 03-27-2001 02:30 PM:

Re: RE

quote:
Originally posted by kscat
Have you ever heard of sarcasim?

Sure. If that's the level you want to take it to, though, have you ever heard of spell checkers?

quote:
Don't be such a pompas ass!

Don't be such a petulant child. You made a silly statement. Be a (wo)man and admit it instead of resorting to name calling and sarcasim [sic].

Posted by bkbk on 03-28-2001 12:48 PM:

"Moose Man
What ever happened to Gary Larson?
Send his children home!
That's him not me in the pic."

"Burnout," he said. Yeah, I really miss the guy too. If not a true genius, close enough.
Do you know if he ever really had kids? (Was that that ref? or was it one of his 'toons?)
It'd be great to hope for another 7-yr. (or so, right?) run like Garry had, in another decade or two.
Worth the wait...

__________________
"Great Spirits Have Always Encountered Violent Opposition From Mediocre Minds." -- Albert Einstein

Posted by RSGMOOSE on 03-28-2001 01:10 PM:

Children?

bbbk,

The children reference is to the many web sites that are not official Gary Larson web sites and are "stealing" his children - his comic strips.

Most of the bio's I've read don't say anything about children but he did get married in 85 so the possibility is there.

Here is a link to a site that explains his children.

http://home.munich.netsurf.de/Rudi....mann/larson.htm

Hence the reason I change my avatar.

__________________
Moose Man
I may be from the LEFT coast but that's not the correct political view in my mind!

Posted by Toby on 03-29-2001 02:31 PM:

Just a followup to this thing...I went to the local OfficeMax yesterday, and they had the silver Edges on display and in stock. The size and weight was pretty tempting, but I'm not sure what I think about the aesthetics of it. The plastic sides are the "issue". I didn't have much time to really look at it, though. The deal clincher that would make me jump to one, though, would be either 1) a color version with a good screen (a 320x320 screen would probably get $450-500 from me for one of these), 2) a 16MB version, or 3) a version with flashROM. Not sure how likely any of these are (3 seems highly unlikely from Handspring), but any or all of them might entice me to switch from my trusty Ice VDx as long as the price didn't break the $500 barrier (although I don't know if any single one of them would justify a $100 jump).

To address the "long wait" aspect of the original thread, if the local Office Max in my tiny hamlet has them, then everyone should have them (and with 3 days left until "the end of the month" - imagine that).

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