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Posted by septimus on 01-19-2002 01:34 AM:

nyah nyah nyah.

What are the other functions of guns that are not a direct result of their killing function?

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Posted by volcanopele on 01-19-2002 03:12 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by dietrichbohn
nyah nyah nyah.

What are the other functions of guns that are not a direct result of their killing function?


I know a few of my dad's friends who collect guns for display purposes only. Hense my earlier "My gun is bigger that your gun" discussion earlier. They have a number of very large guns that they consider their babies. I don't think they even have the ammo for them, just the guns in the display cases.

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Posted by Yorick on 01-19-2002 03:40 AM:

been away. sorry to drag up old news.

Originally posted by Toby
Yorick doesn't seem to have much more experience with them than you do, though, otherwise he'd know better than to think that any semi-automatic weapon could kill dozens in a few seconds.

No direct experience (pacifist ya know), just book learnin' and purportedly accurate "underground" video. Prob'ly just full of it.

Originally posted by volcanopele
I know a few of my dad's friends who collect guns for display purposes only. Hense my earlier "My gun is bigger that your gun" discussion earlier. They have a number of very large guns that they consider their babies. I don't think they even have the ammo for them, just the guns in the display cases.

AHA! it's a male envy issue!
sigh ... men boys and the size of the toys ...

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Posted by septimus on 01-19-2002 04:22 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by volcanopele
I know a few of my dad's friends who collect guns for display purposes only. Hense my earlier "My gun is bigger that your gun" discussion earlier. They have a number of very large guns that they consider their babies. I don't think they even have the ammo for them, just the guns in the display cases.

yeah, i was thinking of this even as I posted. But deep down, I think that the aesthetic appeal is still ancillary at best. Guns call to something deep within us (or within men, anyway), they're phallic and murderous. We have a stick for life, and a stick for death......

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Posted by volcanopele on 01-19-2002 04:26 AM:

My AP Physics class is planning on building a medium size trebuchet. Now in our hands, we are planning just to hurl bowling balls across a football field. In the wrong hands, they will be hurled toward cars. Should we have a licence to building a trebuchet because of its potential for causing SOME minor property damage?

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Posted by septimus on 01-19-2002 04:28 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by volcanopele
My AP Physics class is planning on building a medium size trebuchet. Now in our hands, we are planning just to hurl bowling balls across a football field. In the wrong hands, they will be hurled toward cars. Should we have a licence to building a trebuchet because of its potential for causing SOME minor property damage?

Hey, yet ANOTHER non-murderous application for projectile weapons! Educmacation!

Man, all we got to launch were pumpkins and water-rockets. I envy you, if only becuase you get to use the word "trebuchet" in class!

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Posted by dick-richardson on 01-19-2002 06:00 AM:

My reference to Arabs were meant to prove a point about utilitarianism and punishment. To be honest, I couldn't care less about how "taseful" they might be. The points were incredibly valid on a lot of levels.
1. Utilitarianism. The greater good does not have the right to infringe on an individual's rights. Period. Like it or not, gun ownership is a constitutional right. And all this crap about what is needed for hunting is b-s. The framers of the constitution were hardly saying the right to bear arms should be preserved so I could go rabbit hunting. Mr. Bohn, regardless of the psychology behind owning a gun, the fact that the gov't is dealing with an armed populace guarantees, in a way, the preservation of our constitutionally granted rights. I believe it to be as obvious as a priest with an erection as to the correlation with my Arab example.

2. I should not be forced to give up my rights because of someone else's abuse - Any more than an Arab should be relocated or a child kept in recess for another's misbehavior.

3. I should not be forced to give up my rights because someone else may possibly abuse them. Any more than an Arab should be relocated because one may commit a terrorist act.

And you can pull your "here-and-now" argument and talk about how much times have changed. The times have changed WRT Arabs as well (hence my comment about "more bad people" - a sarcastic statement applicable to both Arabs and gun owners).

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Posted by dick-richardson on 01-19-2002 06:05 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by dietrichbohn
also, I find it ironic that the humor is coming from pro-gun folk, whose extremist pro-gun compatriots would take the jokes literally.

This is the comment that pisses me off. I haven't made generalizations about "your kind," have I? And it wasn't meant to be funny. It was meant to be outrageously ludicrous - and that intent came from a cold-blooded murder advocate, nonetheless!!!! JESUS CHRIST, STRIKE ME DEAD!!!!!

I'll still talk to you, though.

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Abortion: Darwinism at its finest.

Posted by Toby on 01-19-2002 03:25 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by dietrichbohn
What are the other functions of guns that are not a direct result of their killing function?
What you seem to have such a hard time grasping is that if the effective function of over 99% of them is in target practice, protection, display, whatever, then their killing function is the ancillary one. Let's look at it from a utilitarian standpoint: what are you trying to stop by banning a certain (or all) gun(s)? How likely is banning that gun to acheive your goal? Has banning drugs stopped drug use? Did banning alcohol during prohibition stop alcohol use? What is the real problem you think you can solve? Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt? You need to mandate psychological exams then, because it's an irrational fear for the average person to think they're ever going to be shot by an 'assault weapon'.

Posted by Toby on 01-19-2002 03:31 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Yorick
No direct experience (pacifist ya know), just book learnin' and purportedly accurate "underground" video. Prob'ly just full of it.
At least you don't seem to be irrationally fearful about it, though.

Posted by Toby on 01-19-2002 03:35 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by dietrichbohn
[...] Guns call to something deep within us (or within men, anyway), they're phallic and murderous. We have a stick for life, and a stick for death......
LOL...you should read your Fraud better. Actually, people who are that fearful of guns scare me. It shows that they're projecting deep-seated tendencies in themselves which disturb them onto others (much like homophobes).

Posted by Yorick on 01-19-2002 03:52 PM:

Originally posted by Toby
At least you don't seem to be irrationally fearful about it, though.
guns don't kill people -- bullets do! rubber bullets excluded. which begs the question, why don't the police use rubber bullets? think of the bystanders!

Originally posted by Toby
LOL...you should read your Fraud better. Actually, people who are that fearful of guns scare me. It shows that they're projecting deep-seated tendencies in themselves which disturb them onto others (much like homophobes).
hey wait ... if a homophobe is like unto a hoplophobe, is a hoplophone like unto a homophone?
ulp, gotta go, something's ringing.

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Posted by Toby on 01-19-2002 03:53 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by volcanopele
My AP Physics class is planning on building a medium size trebuchet. Now in our hands, we are planning just to hurl bowling balls across a football field. In the wrong hands, they will be hurled toward cars. Should we have a licence to building a trebuchet because of its potential for causing SOME minor property damage?
No, it should be banned because it's an instrument of war, and one of you might go apesh*t and load it with a molotov gas can and hurl it at a McDonald's.

Posted by Toby on 01-19-2002 03:59 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Yorick
guns don't kill people -- bullets do! rubber bullets excluded. which begs the question, why don't the police use rubber bullets? think of the bystanders!
Because tasers don't always work either. There are some cases where only lead poisoning will stop an individual.
quote:
hey wait ... if a homophobe is like unto a hoplophobe, is a hoplophone like unto a homophone?
ulp, gotta go, something's ringing.
Actually, a hoplophone would be redundant since a phone is already an instrument (which is the more generic definition).

Posted by volcanopele on 01-19-2002 04:21 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
No, it should be banned because it's an instrument of war, and one of you might go apesh*t and load it with a molotov gas can and hurl it at a McDonald's.


What you don't think we can't control ourselves with our precious trebuchet. I for one would never hurl anything a McDonald's. Sonic, well thats another story. Then we just wouldn't hurl anything that might kill people.

Seriously thoug, we are building it to hurl bowling balls 100 yards and thats all. Though I want to make it collapsable so I can take it with me to Tucson.

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Posted by Toby on 01-19-2002 04:30 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by volcanopele
What you don't think we can't control ourselves with our precious trebuchet. I for one would never hurl anything a McDonald's. Sonic, well thats another story. Then we just wouldn't hurl anything that might kill people.

Seriously thoug, we are building it to hurl bowling balls 100 yards and thats all. Though I want to make it collapsable so I can take it with me to Tucson.
Oh, we're not worried about what _YOU_ might do with it. We just want to make sure that a criminal can't get hold of one and take out a McDonald's. Who are you to put your understanding of physics over the fake feelings of safety of others?

edit: Wow, I just noticed that I broke 1500 posts, on my birthday no less. Happy birthday to me...time to get offline.

Posted by volcanopele on 01-19-2002 04:53 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
Oh, we're not worried about what _YOU_ might do with it. We just want to make sure that a criminal can't get hold of one and take out a McDonald's. Who are you to put your understanding of physics over the fake feelings of safety of others?

edit: Wow, I just noticed that I broke 1500 posts, on my birthday no less. Happy birthday to me...time to get offline.


McDonald's attacked by a midieval siege weapon. More at eleven. One way to protect against it getting in the wrong hands is to disassemble most of it after every use that way you can't just cart it off and use it somewhere else. Besides, Toby, do you know how big trebuchets are?? This one is going to be in the neighbor of 20 feet long and 7 feet tall with the counterweight consisting of machine weights total in the neighborhood of 200 lbs. And thats a wussy trebuchet compared to those used in midieval warfare.

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Posted by Toby on 01-19-2002 05:33 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by volcanopele
McDonald's attacked by a midieval siege weapon. More at eleven. One way to protect against it getting in the wrong hands is to disassemble most of it after every use that way you can't just cart it off and use it somewhere else.
That would seem to make it easier to transport.
quote:
Besides, Toby, do you know how big trebuchets are??
Yes, I'm being facetious. I don't really care if you have a trebuchet.
quote:
This one is going to be in the neighbor of 20 feet long and 7 feet tall with the counterweight consisting of machine weights total in the neighborhood of 200 lbs. And thats a wussy trebuchet compared to those used in midieval warfare.
So, it's a compact 'handgun' version of a trebuchet?!? That's even worse.

Posted by volcanopele on 01-19-2002 05:50 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
So, it's a compact 'handgun' version of a trebuchet?!? That's even worse.


Do you think we should built the "assult weapon" version, 60 feet long and capable of hurling cars?

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Posted by Toby on 01-19-2002 08:26 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by volcanopele
Do you think we should built the "assult weapon" version, 60 feet long and capable of hurling cars?
The problem is that this wouldn't be the 'assault weapon' model. The 'assault weapon' model would function the same way as the 'semi-automatic rifle' model, but it would just look 'scarier'.

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