VisorCentral.com - Lawsuits and cameras everywhere one day?

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VisorCentral.com (http://discussion.visorcentral.com/vcforum/index.php)
- Off Topic (http://discussion.visorcentral.com/vcforum/forumdisplay.php?forumid=6)
-- Lawsuits and cameras everywhere one day? (http://discussion.visorcentral.com/vcforum/showthread.php?threadid=8954)

Posted by Celchu19 on 12-30-2000 03:39 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by bkbk
The subject at hand is NOT MiniJam...
...it is the PHANTOM "SixPack."

It has NEVER existed, but from the start (over 1 yr. now) InnoGear fraudulently "pretended" it did -- with an IMAGE of said phantom "SixPack," as if it had been PROTOTYPED ALREADY.

Then phony "release date" after phony "release date."

This goes way, way, way beyond "deceptive advertising," I believe to the level of fraud, and I think meriting a Class Action Suit.

And, by the way, it SHOULD be illegal for the SW industry as a whole to "perpetually deceive the public about release dates." Sadly, it's time for the U.S. gov't. to step in and levy SERIOUS FINES against companies that play this "unrealistic" game.

Either your product is READY, or shut up about it.

That's why SoundsGood has earned such immense goodwill, not just from Visor owners, but Jeff Hawkins himself.

ASK JEFF HAWKINS WHAT HE THINKS OF INNOGEAR.

On a strictly leagle sense, how can you prove beyond reasonable doubt that a company dosen't have genuine reasons for pushing back a release date. Also for it to pass as a class action, who do you cover in the suit? Every visor user? If you do that, 1. it would be dissmissed before it even started, and 2. that would be one way to crash the company, they did come out with the mini-jam even though it was 'unreasonably late', and by sueing them you would prevent them from ever releasing another module, becuase they would be forced to declare backruptcy and that wouldn't help you at all.

sam

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"Everybody don't like something and we all don't like you." -- Richard Thompson, Hard Luck Stories

Posted by Celchu19 on 12-30-2000 03:52 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by bkbk
MOST injustices (I believe) could be DONE AWAY WITH BEFORE THE FACT if we would only have VIDEO (+AUDIO, NOT SILENT) CAMERAS EVERYWHERE (like they presently do in Monaco and Britain, where crime is *microscopic* as a consequence).

Big Brother Is watching

Posted by bkbk on 12-30-2000 05:13 AM:

Celchu19

A number of your postings imply you haven't read through this entire thread. Please do so when you get a chance (I realize it's a lot of material, and am sorry READING IS STILL THE "LOW-TECH. / SLOW-TECH." THAT IT IS -- LET'S WORK ON THIS, GUYS!)

When you say "Big Brother is Watching," you fail to acknowledge the previous posts that have already addressed this "assertion" (which in fact seems to have no wisdom in 2001, and I only wish George Orwell [i.e., Eric Blair] were alive today to state as much -- because in an Erich Fromme "Escape From Freedom" manner [an excellent read, people, and seriously seminal], some people seem to think that ONLY ORWELL'S WORD WOULD WORK HERE).
ITS IMPORTANT THAT THE PEOPLE ON THIS FORUM DO ALL THEY CAN TO ENSURE THAT "OUR COMPUTERS WATCH BIG BROTHER'S COMPUTERS" -- IRRESPECTIVE OF WHETHER BIG BROTHER "WANTS US TO." WE, THE PEOPLE, SHALL DECIDE.

===========================
"BREVITY is the SOUL of WIT," people.
===========================
(Sigmund Freud's quote.)
And more than likely, THE OPPOSITE.
HENCE BREVITY AND PROFUNDITY ARE LIKELY DIAMETRICALLY OPPOSED. HENCE, IT'S UNLIKELY A GOOD IDEA TO ATTEMPT PROFUNDITY BY GIVING THE TRUTH THE SHORT SHRIFT.

Indeed, without even much close inspection, from simply reading Peck's "P.O.T.L." it is fairly clear that BREVITY is a fundamental methodology of those Dr. Peck has labeled as evil (and pretty clearly illus. that they in fact are).

Happy Holidays to all.
I continue to be very grateful and inspired that by and large the dialogue here has been very earnest and even soul-searching.

Since a future technocracy is most likely, it's important that people like those accessing this forum at this time continue to grow in their knowledge and desire re humanity as much as tech.
(Einstein's "Religion w/out Science is Blind; Science w/out Religion is Lame" [sorry for not looking up the exact quote] quote comes to mind, esp. if we substitute "Humanity" for Religion -- something Dr. Peck essentially asserts in "T.R.L.T.)

[Edited by bkbk on 12-31-2000 at 04:54 PM]

Posted by Fat_Man on 12-30-2000 05:31 AM:

Ha Ha Ha!!! That's funny!!

Man, where was I went this tread was heating up? Oh my gosh, bkbk are you serious? You want to take a company to court because they were late/delayed? That's got to be the funniest, stupidest, weirdest thing that I have read since the "screen protection patent" tread. BKBK, those posting of A+B=X if X-Y=Z then A+Z= "I need to take innogear to court", those were classic!! Ha Ha Ha.

Hate to break it to ya... Innogear has done NOTHING illegal!! Sure they failed to deliver a product on a date that they forcasted. If everyone subscribe to your logic then a lot of weather forcaster are going to jail. So you got your feelings hurt and you were disappointed that's not a reason to take a company to court.

Come-on, tell me that you are kidding!!

If you are not kidding... so... when is that "Innogear is the Mark of the Beast" manifesto coming out?

[Edited by Fat_Man on 12-30-2000 at 12:38 AM]

__________________
Fat's

Posted by acajigas on 12-30-2000 05:32 AM:

Excuse me guys but...are we still talking about the sixpack as a product or about the abstract topics that the sixpack could bring, which not so many people care.

Here are some news from Innogear:

Dear Customer,
Thank you for your recent e-mail. Innogear is continuing to work and bring
this module to market at this time, there is not a set release date, but we
expect it in 1Q, 2001 MSRP will be about $199.00. We have no further
information at this moment. If you have any further comments fill free to
contact us any time.

Thanks

Al

__________________
It all started way back in February 2000 with a Blue VDX.

Posted by Herkimer on 12-30-2000 06:38 AM:

Please don't let me but butt in. I need a modem link to my nokia phone and unless someone other than ***hole gear comes up with one i will buy it even thought it is $200 it will be less money than me moving to somewhere that i can buy and or have an IR phone (and faster) so while i live in the USA (As with our vote) i will take what i can get even if i don't like the price it cost. Four years from now maybe we will have IR (a real president) and all be happy but for now well for now i will just have to buy from ***hole Gear and work with what i can get.......
am i wrong.....having fun..... hope you are toooooo.

Posted by Gameboy70 on 12-30-2000 05:50 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by bkbk
===========================
"BREVITY is the SOUL of WIT," people.
===========================
(Sigmund Freud's quote.)

Uh, that's Shakespeare. But yes, Fromm's Escape From Freedom rocks. Can't say the same for the Caps Lock key.

Posted by JHromadka on 12-31-2000 04:52 AM:

The only way a company should be punished for delays is the public's perception of it. There are several people on this board that have said they will not buy from IG, so in a sense it is being held accountable for its actions.

BTW, telling people "Go read POTL" is an easy way out so you don't have to explain your position. I also suggest that you use vB code instead of the CAPS LOCK key as you will find that people will be much more receptive.

Moving to off-topic. Keep it civil.

__________________
James Hromadka
Old Friend

Posted by dick-richardson on 12-31-2000 07:42 PM:

James, I'm talking TO my LAWYER about your MOVING this to OFF-topic. You DISAPPOINTED me. The fact that you're THE moderator doesn't PUT YOU above THE law. It's MY First Ammendment right TO POST where AND when I please. And LET'S talk ABOUT civil for A second. You obviously didn't SEE the NEWS about all THE things GOING wrong IN America that IS directly THE result OF lawyers, POLITICIANS, doctors, paper BOYS, fishing POLE manufacturers, Coca-Cola, the NFL, TIME-life, my ex-GIRLFRIEND, and VC discussion MODERATORS. I REFUSE TO BE SILENCED. AS LONG AS THERE ARE INJUSTICES IN THE WORLD I WILL POST ON VC TO HAVE THE GREATEST IMPACT I POSSIBLY CAN TO ADDRESS THEM. I WILL ALSO READ AND RECOMMEND YOUR LOCAL LIBRARY'S ENTIRE COLLECTION SO YOU CAN ALL BE AS SMART AS I. I REFUSE TO USE THIS ENERGY FOR ANYTHING PRODUCTIVE TO HELP THOSE TRULY IN NEED - I WILL USE IT TO ***** ABOUT THE INJUSTICES YOUR KIND PERPETUATES. If this is too deep for anyone I apologize for your stupidity.

__________________
-Joshua
Abortion: Darwinism at its finest.

Posted by MarkEagle on 12-31-2000 08:55 PM:

uh oh...

__________________

God bless America, my home sweet home...

Posted by bkbk on 12-31-2000 10:14 PM:

... funny, Mark.

Okay, folks, I can see I've expended the available attention span for more & more of the ... uh, "members," I guess we'd have to (unfortunately) classify them. (With any luck, God will take good care of them this New Year's.)

It's important, before I stop posting to this thread, to note that COMEDY IS AT THE BORDERLINE OF EVIL -- since the hallmark of comedy is lying:

"Take My Wife -- Please." (Henny Youngman)

And I should note, after nearly 4,000 views, and dozens of postings that many people still don't seem to get (and no one's actually stated) REAL DAMAGES INNOGEAR'S CAUSED TO EACH AND EVERY VISOR OWNER IS "DUPING THEM" INTO "NOT BUYING" THE 8MB FLASH MODULE MADE BY HANDSPRING ... ON THE "PROMISE" (LIE) THAT THERE IN FACT WAS A 2ND "MEMORY" MODULE (W/OTHER FEATURES) "IN THE WINGS." But likely hundreds if not thousands held back from expanding our memory on this "promise / lie."

And once more, it's clear that the humans on this board (myself included) simply aren't up to the task of factoring millions / billions / trillions / quadrillions / quintillions of infinitesimal considerations into the laws that need to be in place -- WITHOUT BIAS, PREJUDICE, OR "LOOKING AT THE FUNNY SIDE", so we must move to A.I. expert computer systems to KEEP THE HUMANS HONEST AND ACCURATE.

As Dr. Peck (author of the 2 greatest books ever written, which is hardly "asking everyone to read every book in the library" -- just to be knowledgeable about the 2 at the very top; and I'd hardly bring it up if I thought anyone accessing this board "wasn't smart enough to read them"; quite the opposite) has noted, in interviews:

"To be really good doubters, sooner or later we must come to doubt our doubts."

As I noted many postings ago, it is the CONSISTENCY OF INNOGEAR'S LIES THAT INSPIRES HATRED, QUITE PROPERLY AND NATURALLY. Not 1 mistake, or 2 -- but about a dozen, now. Pretty remarkable.

Sure, it's "cute" and "amusing" that there are presently no "laws" or "contracts" that "mandate" that Innogear and/or other companies function ethically ... but, if they don't function ethically, they only have themselves to blame when people who function on that supreme level (not on the base level of laws, which are virtually always BENEATH ethics, sadly) COME AFTER THEM FULL BORE.

Posted by MarkEagle on 01-01-2001 12:20 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by bkbk
... funny, Mark.
...
REAL DAMAGES INNOGEAR'S CAUSED TO EACH AND EVERY VISOR OWNER IS "DUPING THEM" INTO "NOT BUYING" THE 8MB FLASH MODULE MADE BY HANDSPRING ... ON THE "PROMISE" (LIE) THAT THERE IN FACT WAS A 2ND "MEMORY" MODULE (W/OTHER FEATURES) "IN THE WINGS."

First off, thank you

As a Visor owner, I was not duped into anything! Yes, the SixPak appealed to me, but the promise of it did not prevent me from moving on. I got connectivity through my Thinmodem, and while I'm still looking for flash RAM, it's not a necessity for me at this time. And remember, in another few weeks, there will be another 8mb storage option called the Thinmodem+.

p.s. if anyone ever pursues this lame class-action, please leave my name off of it.

__________________

God bless America, my home sweet home...

Posted by dick-richardson on 01-01-2001 07:14 AM:

The hallmark of comedy is truth. It's the little deceptions we tell ourselves stripped away. Sometimes it takes exaggeration to make it visible, but that exaggeration does not preclude truth. If you didn't like the humor it's only due to your inability to accept criticism. How does championing your cause on VC address the injustices you see? How is your superior attitude going to persuade me to read those books you hold so dear? You attack the humor but conveniently overlook the criticisms brought forth. You "classify" me however you want. I answer to one person, and you aren't it. You keep on posting quotes from famous philosophers out of context and I'll post quotes from myself.

quote:
Originally posted by myself
James, I'm talking TO my LAWYER about your MOVING this to OFF-topic. You DISAPPOINTED me. The fact that you're THE moderator doesn't PUT YOU above THE law. It's MY First Ammendment right TO POST where AND when I please. And LET'S talk ABOUT civil for A second. You obviously didn't SEE the NEWS about all THE things GOING wrong IN America that IS directly THE result OF lawyers, POLITICIANS, doctors, paper BOYS, fishing POLE manufacturers, Coca-Cola, the NFL, TIME-life, my ex-GIRLFRIEND, and VC discussion MODERATORS. I REFUSE TO BE SILENCED. AS LONG AS THERE ARE INJUSTICES IN THE WORLD I WILL POST ON VC TO HAVE THE GREATEST IMPACT I POSSIBLY CAN TO ADDRESS THEM. I WILL ALSO READ AND RECOMMEND YOUR LOCAL LIBRARY'S ENTIRE COLLECTION SO YOU CAN ALL BE AS SMART AS I. I REFUSE TO USE THIS ENERGY FOR ANYTHING PRODUCTIVE TO HELP THOSE TRULY IN NEED - I WILL USE IT TO ***** ABOUT THE INJUSTICES YOUR KIND PERPETUATES. If this is too deep for anyone I apologize for your stupidity.

__________________
-Joshua
Abortion: Darwinism at its finest.

Posted by bkbk on 01-01-2001 07:51 AM:

Quoth:
"The hallmark of comedy is truth. It's the little deceptions we tell ourselves stripped away. Sometimes it takes exaggeration to make it visible, but that exaggeration does not preclude truth. If you didn't like the humor it's only due to your inability to accept criticism. How does championing your cause on VC address the injustices you see? How is your superior attitude going to persuade me to read those books you hold so dear? You attack the humor but conveniently overlook the criticisms brought forth. You "classify" me however you want. I answer to one person, and you aren't it. You keep on posting quotes from famous philosophers out of context and I'll post quotes from myself."

"The hallmark of comedy is truth."
Uh ... yeah -- like when Eddie Murphy (Richard Pryor, Jim Carrey, etc.) walks on a set and says, "Hi, I'm Madonna!" Lots of TRUTH there.
It's FUNNY because it's a bald-faced LIE.

The remainder of your genius-level ramblings (another bald-faced LIE, comedian) could just as easily be picked apart, but I'm busy right now. Make another post when you have something cogent and intelligent to say. If we have to wait until you're 90, I'll understand.

[Edited by bkbk on 01-01-2001 at 02:56 AM]

Posted by Vertigo on 01-01-2001 09:57 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by bkbk
... funny, Mark.

Okay, folks, I can see I've expended the available attention span for more & more of the ... uh, "members," I guess we'd have to (unfortunately) classify them. (With any luck, God will take good care of them this New Year's.)

It's important, before I stop posting to this thread, to note that COMEDY IS AT THE BORDERLINE OF EVIL -- since the hallmark of comedy is lying:

"Take My Wife -- Please." (Henny Youngman)

Oh, Wonderful. Another raving religious lunatic.

You obviously think everyone here is lesser than you, by the way you refer to them. Your attitude and posting style needs to change before most people will choose to respond to your posts.

quote:

And I should note, after nearly 4,000 views, and dozens of postings that many people still don't seem to get (and no one's actually stated) REAL DAMAGES INNOGEAR'S CAUSED TO EACH AND EVERY VISOR OWNER IS "DUPING THEM" INTO "NOT BUYING" THE 8MB FLASH MODULE MADE BY HANDSPRING ... ON THE "PROMISE" (LIE) THAT THERE IN FACT WAS A 2ND "MEMORY" MODULE (W/OTHER FEATURES) "IN THE WINGS." But likely hundreds if not thousands held back from expanding our memory on this "promise / lie."

So you think Innogear should be punished for 'DUPING/TRICKING' us into NOT buying something?
Who was hurt by us (consumers) not buying an 8MB Flash Module? We, the consumers, were not. Handspring was. Yet, your still saying that we should file a class action suit against Innogear for not delivering. Hmm. I believe you are out of your mind.

Announcing a product is far from PROMISING it.
Some announced products never make it to market.

quote:

And once more, it's clear that the humans on this board (myself included) simply aren't up to the task of factoring millions / billions / trillions / quadrillions / quintillions of infinitesimal considerations into the laws that need to be in place -- WITHOUT BIAS, PREJUDICE, OR "LOOKING AT THE FUNNY SIDE", so we must move to A.I. expert computer systems to KEEP THE HUMANS HONEST AND ACCURATE.

You seem to want to turn humans into meaningless drones who don't know how to think for themselves.

How do you think an all knowing A.I. system will come about? HUMANS will have to program it to learn. If you think humans aren't capable enough to create laws, neither will A.I. systems that were created by humans. There have been so many Sci-Fi Movies about A.I. I won't bother to go on.

Posted by Vertigo on 01-01-2001 10:11 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by bkbk
[snip]
"The hallmark of comedy is truth."
Uh ... yeah -- like when Eddie Murphy (Richard Pryor, Jim Carrey, etc.) walks on a set and says, "Hi, I'm Madonna!" Lots of TRUTH there.
It's FUNNY because it's a bald-faced LIE.

The remainder of your genius-level ramblings (another bald-faced LIE, comedian) could just as easily be picked apart, but I'm busy right now. Make another post when you have something cogent and intelligent to say. If we have to wait until you're 90, I'll understand.
[snip]

It's amazing anyone here is taking you seriously at all. You are a complete ass. You just tackle parts of people's posts that make no difference to the discussion, and then say 'The remainder of your ... [post] could just as easily be picked apart, but I'm busy right now'. You act superior to everyone you reply to, yet you post nothing to back yourself up, saying something like, "Read <book> by <author> and you will have a better understanding. I don't have the time to explain this complex idea to you stupid fools.".

I say we need to leave bkbk to his inane ramblings, since he is completely closed minded, our replies will make no difference to his stance on the subject.

Posted by dick-richardson on 01-01-2001 04:04 PM:

Good point vertigo, and you are absolutely correct on the fact that bkbk refuses to comment on the parts of a post that he can't deal with. He still hasn't answered how his posting on VC makes a difference for those issues he feels so strongly about. Just like his stance on humor. He finds one type of joke that supports his opinion and that (of course) means that there is no truth in any humor. I hope he doesn't watch movies/plays because those are obviously blatant fabrications, and as such can't reveal anything about the human condition other than condoning liers. Being that "It's a Wonderful Life" is one large and composed lie from beginning to end (not to mention Les Miserables or the myriad of others that have toted having an insight into the human condition) precludes the possibility of any real meaning. I just can't wait to see what movie he picks to support his fanatical ideas. I'm surprised he reads books. I've read a couple of Dr Suess books that seemed pretty far fetched to me. Thank God that I read those before looking the encyclopedia for information. Who knows what wild, crazy ideas I'd fall for (I'd probably believe people walked on the moon or some such). At least I've been upgraded to a comedian. I've been a smart ass for a long time and it's good to know I'm moving up in the world.

__________________
-Joshua
Abortion: Darwinism at its finest.

Posted by MarkEagle on 01-01-2001 04:20 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by dick-richardson
Being that "It's a Wonderful Life" is one large and composed lie from beginning to end...

Hmmm... maybe that's why I'm such a bad person since it's one of my favorites!

Does this mean that Hamlet was a lie, too?

__________________

God bless America, my home sweet home...

Posted by Gameboy70 on 01-01-2001 05:47 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by MarkEagle
Does this mean that Hamlet was a lie, too?

Hmm, I don't know if Hamlet was a lie, but Hamlet was definitely guilty of plagiarism when he ripped off the "Brevity is the soul of wit" line from Freud.

Posted by matty on 01-01-2001 06:05 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Gameboy70
quote:
Originally posted by MarkEagle
Does this mean that Hamlet was a lie, too?

Hmm, I don't know if Hamlet was a lie, but Hamlet was definitely guilty of plagiarism when he ripped off the "Brevity is the soul of wit" line from Freud.

while i love the intent of this post, and think it's incredibly funny (i.e.: evil?), hamlet didn't say it, either: polonius did...

sorry for the nitpick...

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