VisorCentral.com - Web slowdown caused by Iraq

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-- Web slowdown caused by Iraq (http://discussion.visorcentral.com/vcforum/showthread.php?threadid=26443)

Posted by yardie on 09-06-2002 03:53 PM:

Here we go slightly off topic again... But this is not in the Off Topic forum for nothing. I support the legalization of marijuana. Why should alcohol and tobbacco be legal and not marijuana?

My position is this:

1. marijuana should be decriminalized or

2. Tobacco should become illegal (along with marijuans).

quote:
Originally posted by KRamsauer

Yeah, I realized after I made that post the underhand shot at Canada's push to legalize it. I need to think before using a cliche again. :-)

Posted by Toby on 09-06-2002 04:51 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by septimus
Toby, I'm beginning to think you are physically incapable of changing your opinion.

Not at all. Quite the contrary. I'm not going to change my opinion, though, unless I get new and convincing evidence that the bases for my previous opinions were wrong. You're thinking that I disagree with a position because I don't know enough about Ritter. I'm saying that whatever Ritter's qualifications as a weapons inspector and no matter what he saw, he's making a bad assumption to think that Saddam is going to play nice. If anything, it makes me think him a bigger fool to think that. Someone who didn't see everything Saddam had done thinking it? I might not see that as foolish. Him? Ridiculous. What do I know, though? I think we shouldn't have bothered saving Kuwait the first time. With their money, they should have hired their own army.

Posted by Toby on 09-06-2002 04:53 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Yorick
should we be smoking Canada then?

I personally wouldn't, but if you do it and don't bother me or mine with it, I couldn't care less.

quote:
so are you ...
...because an opinion is emotional or mental, not physical.
*beats septimus about the head and shoulders with the logic stick*

Actually, some people's opinions can become quite psychosomatic.

Posted by Toby on 09-06-2002 04:57 PM:

Re: Re: Re: Canadian Elections aren't 1 Vote per person either

quote:
Originally posted by yardie
This is ridiculous.

Well, I didn't say I endorsed it. I just found it interesting that some regular citizens think they have enough connective evidence to file a lawsuit, and people are doubting whether the President's men have anything.

quote:
Whatsup with all these crazy lawsuits?

It's like a lotto ticket.

quote:
And how will the victims get Iraq to pay them 1 trillion dollars if they win?

I'd think that Al-Qaeda and maybe Iraq would have to have some funds frozen somewhere considering the first Persian Gulf thing and 9/11.

Posted by Toby on 09-06-2002 05:00 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by yardie
Here we go slightly off topic again... But this is not in the Off Topic forum for nothing. I support the legalization of marijuana. Why should alcohol and tobbacco be legal and not marijuana?

I think we should just make stupid people with no self-control illegal.

quote:
My position is this:

1. marijuana should be decriminalized or

2. Tobacco should become illegal (along with marijuans).

*shrug*

Posted by KRamsauer on 09-06-2002 06:28 PM:

Re: Re: Canadian Elections aren't 1 Vote per person either

quote:
Originally posted by yardie
For teh record, I think the U.S system is much better and much more democratic that the Parliamentary system that we adopted from Britain. This doesn't take away from the fact that half a million souls wasted their time to vote for Al Gore.

Well, technically everyone who voted for Al Gore threw away their vote because he lost. Your logic escapes me.

quote:

The arguement you made about children and felons not having the vote does not hold water. Why? They never voted only to have their vote thrown out as irrelevant to begin with.

You said "one person one vote." I was showing you such a principle is crazy and was never real.

Posted by K. Cannon on 09-06-2002 06:40 PM:

The electoral college system in place in the United States is not and has never been "one person, one vote."

Posted by BobbyMike on 09-06-2002 08:59 PM:

I think we shouldn't have bothered saving Kuwait the first time. With their money, they should have hired their own army.

Or we shouldn't have stopped merely when Iraq said "Enough!".
We wouldn't be having this discussion if we (our elected officials and their handpicked advisors) knew how to buck up and finish something properly. Past administrations helped to create the present position that Saddam enjoys. You comment about stupid people with no self-control and your other past comments about people lacking responsibility for their actions would seem to apply here.
And the Kuwaits (Kuwaitians?) did hire their own army- us!
It's all about the access to their oil!
At this point I would almost support action specifically against Saddam - except that he is so paranoid that any such attempt would have hardly any chance for success.

__________________
"I am a debtor both to Greeks and to Barbarians, both to the wise and to the foolish."

Posted by Toby on 09-06-2002 09:49 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by BobbyMike
Or we shouldn't have stopped merely when Iraq said "Enough!".
We wouldn't be having this discussion if we (our elected officials and their handpicked advisors) knew how to buck up and finish something properly. [...]

I could have sworn I mentioned the MacArthur parallels already.

quote:
And the Kuwaits (Kuwaitians?) did hire their own army- us!

Kuwaitis. The US army wasn't supposed to be a gang of mercenaries last time I looked at the Constitution.

quote:
It's all about the access to their oil!
At this point I would almost support action specifically against Saddam - except that he is so paranoid that any such attempt would have hardly any chance for success.

If history is any indicator, the CIA will finance some internal dissident to try and stage a coup which will be botched, and it'll be the Bay of Pigs redux.

Posted by yardie on 09-06-2002 10:32 PM:

I know this. but what is the point encouraging people to vote in Presidental elections? Why are there middlemen called "electors"? This system itself is not even uniform across the country. My understanding is that some states in all or nothing, while in other states the amount of electors that you get depends on the percentage of vote. Not to mention the fact that voting methods vary from state to state.

quote:
Originally posted by K. Cannon
The electoral college system in place in the United States is not and has never been "one person, one vote."

Posted by yardie on 09-06-2002 10:34 PM:

Re: Re: Re: Canadian Elections aren't 1 Vote per person either

Well wasn't this my arguement all along? The biggest chunk of Americans who bothered to vote got their votes tossed out because of the electoral system.

quote:
Originally posted by KRamsauer
Well, technically everyone who voted for Al Gore threw away their vote because he lost. Your logic escapes me.

You said "one person one vote." I was showing you such a principle is crazy and was never real.

Posted by tantousha on 09-06-2002 11:37 PM:

Read "Stupid White Men" by that guy...can't remember his name and I lent out the book..and you will realize just how Gore "Lost" the race...
Alex.

__________________
Goodbye my lovely Treo
HELLO TG50

Posted by adderx99 on 09-07-2002 01:35 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by tantousha
Read "Stupid White Men" by that guy...can't remember his name and I lent out the book..and you will realize just how Gore "Lost" the race...
Alex.

michael moore i think

why do canadians care about the US anyways?
how do you spell annex?

__________________
I love my Treo 90.

Posted by tantousha on 09-07-2002 01:43 AM:

We (well not ALL of us...some of us) care about the US because if you guys screw up than we will be inadvertantly affected...If the US starts to Bomb Iraq and the rest of the Middle East decides to back Iraq by turning off the oil pipeline...gas prices in Canada (Not just America) will go through the roof (remember the seventies? I don't but I've read about it). Also Bush and his crazy international trade ideas has cost the Canadian economy billions in lost revenue from you guys...for America's number 1 trading partner he sure is screwing us around...
Alex.

__________________
Goodbye my lovely Treo
HELLO TG50

Posted by EricG on 09-07-2002 04:49 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by tantousha
(remember the seventies?

sadly enough yes I do.... i was a kid, but I do, one of the first things I recall being able to read was an "Impeach Nixon" bumper sticker.

__________________
"One of the most important things you learn from the internet is that there is no �them� out there. It�s just an awful lot of �us�." -- Douglas Adams

Posted by Toby on 09-07-2002 04:04 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by yardie
I know this. but what is the point encouraging people to vote in Presidental elections?

Because they can possibly make a difference within the state in which they live.

quote:
Why are there middlemen called "electors"?

For the same reason that there are middlemen called "Congressmen". It was a compromise between the larger and smaller states to try and ensure that everyone's interests were represented as fairly as possibly. If the bigger states could bully around the smaller states in all things, the smaller states would have never agreed to the Union, and the United States wouldn't exist.

quote:
This system itself is not even uniform across the country.

That's due to the nature of the Republic. Keep in mind that there wasn't just one big colony which formed a country. It was a hodgepodge of independent states which formed a representative republic. Think of it similar to the EU to an extent. France can't tell Britain how to elect its leaders, nor vice versa.

quote:
My understanding is that some states in all or nothing, while in other states the amount of electors that you get depends on the percentage of vote. Not to mention the fact that voting methods vary from state to state.

That's the way the cookie crumbles.

Posted by yardie on 09-07-2002 07:24 PM:

Well the U.S is our biggest trading partner a a behemoth on the continent. We also share one of the longest borders in the world.

quote:
Originally posted by adderx99

michael moore i think

why do canadians care about the US anyways?
how do you spell annex?

Posted by adderx99 on 09-08-2002 04:42 AM:

you're right. hey..... your(Ca) not thinking of invading(US), are you?
Mexico is invading one person at a time, while carrying "controled substances" to boot.

__________________
I love my Treo 90.

Posted by yardie on 09-08-2002 07:28 AM:

Hehehe

Mexico is just taking back what's theirs. Half of all Americans will be latino in a hundred years.

quote:
Originally posted by adderx99
you're right. hey..... your(Ca) not thinking of invading(US), are you?
Mexico is invading one person at a time, while carrying "controled substances" to boot.

Posted by KRamsauer on 09-08-2002 10:11 PM:

Re: Re: Re: Re: Canadian Elections aren't 1 Vote per person either

quote:
Originally posted by yardie
Well wasn't this my arguement all along? The biggest chunk of Americans who bothered to vote got their votes tossed out because of the electoral system.

You said half a million, or roughly # who voted for Gore - # voted for Bush. What I was just referring to is the faulty logic of "if you candidate doesn't win your vote was wasted."

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