VisorCentral.com - CompactFlash vs SmartMedia Costs

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VisorCentral.com (http://discussion.visorcentral.com/vcforum/index.php)
- Springboard Modules (http://discussion.visorcentral.com/vcforum/forumdisplay.php?forumid=10)
-- CompactFlash vs SmartMedia Costs (http://discussion.visorcentral.com/vcforum/showthread.php?threadid=15651)

Posted by Swiftshadow on 06-03-2001 02:47 AM:

Given that Portable Innovations appear have the most advanced memory expansion solution for us Visor users, I started looking at what it would cost me to expand the memory of my Visor Prism. Since I already gathered these numbers, I figured they could be useful to someone else.

Prices for memory are based on searches done today (6/2/01) on shopper.cnet.com. The price per megabyte is based on the lowest price that Cnet returned. I did not double check availability, shipping charges etc... If you find better numbers, please share them with the rest of us. All prices are in $US. With all of this being said, here are the numbers.

CompactFlash Card Cost per meg

512 Meg CF Card $543.00 ($1.0605 per meg)
320 Meg CF Card $375.98 ($1.1749 per meg)
256 Meg CF Card $299.95 ($1.1717 per meg)
192 Meg CF Card $168.48 ($0.8775 per meg)
160 Meg CF Card $134.16 ($0.8385 per meg)
128 Meg CF Card $106.27 ($0.8302 per meg)
96 Meg CF Card $75.92 ($0.7908 per meg)
64 Meg CF Card $52.00 ($0.8125 per meg)
32 Meg CF Card $29.12 ($0.91 per meg)
16 Meg CF Card $24.96 ($1.56 per meg)
8 Meg CF Card $15.60 ($1.95 per meg)

SmartMedia Card Cost per meg

128 Meg SM Card $110.00 ($0.8594 per meg)
64 Meg SM Card $48.95 ($0.7648 per meg)
32 Meg SM Card $22.88 ($0.715 per meg)
16 Meg SM Card $14.30 ($0.8937 per meg)
8 Meg SM Card $11.44 ($1.43 per meg)

Just for comparison purposes, I also checked out MultiMedia Card prices. Who knows, Portable Innovation might come out with a MemPlug for MM cards also.

MultiMedia Card Cost per meg

64 Meg MM Card $77.34 ($1.2084 per meg)
32 Meg MM Card $37.44 ($ 1.2084 per meg)
16 Meg MM Card $26.00 ($1.625 per meg)
8 Meg MM Card $23.92 ($2.99 per meg)

This info confirms what most have said: SmartMedia cards seem to have the lowest cost per megabyte of the 3 card types surveyed. Compact Flash is a bit more expensive and MultiMedia is significantly more expensive. You can find memory for CompactFlash and SmartMedia at less than $0.80 per meg, which I think is bearable for most users. For CompactFlash, the best deal is the 96 Meg card. For SmartMedia, the 32 Meg card is the best deal, followed closely by the 64 Meg card. Stay away from the lower densities. I would say its not worth buying a CF card with less than 32 Megs (below that capacity you're paying more than $1.00 per meg.) It also doesn't pay to buy a SM card with less than 16 Megs.

MultiMedia Cards look pretty bleak in these numbers. Are there significant advantages to them that can offset the high cost per megabyte? Or is size their only advantage?

I hope these numbers will help some of you out there.

Take care
Swiftshadow

Posted by miradu on 06-03-2001 03:44 AM:

Wow! Good work.

I have a strong feeling that there is a cheaper 128 mb SM card..

MMC is dead, and CF becasue of the controllers is always goign to be cheaper. Because SM just has the memory, it hopefully will always be cheaper. One thing to say also is that Pi is totally leading the way for Memory Expansion. I hope to soon see Memory Stick modules, and SD modules - one that can also accept ALL SD cards and modules...

Also, what about desiging a module that is passthrough? IE. it allows for a memory sb and an eyemod at once! YEAH!

__________________
-miradu

Posted by Vinny on 06-03-2001 04:14 AM:

Nice work! I found a bit cheaper prices at Newegg though--here's a quick breakdown.

128MB CF $74 (.58/meg)
64MB CF $47 (.73/meg)
32MB CF $28 (.86/meg)

128MB SM $107 (.84/meg)
64MB SM $ 44 (.69/meg)
32MB SM $ 24 (.75/meg)

If 64MB SM ever breaks the $35 range I will definitely pick up a piece for my Rio500 .

__________________
-Vincent

Posted by Swiftshadow on 06-03-2001 04:26 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Vinny
Nice work! I found a bit cheaper prices at Newegg though--here's a quick breakdown.

128MB CF $74 (.58/meg)
64MB CF $47 (.73/meg)
32MB CF $28 (.86/meg)

128MB SM $107 (.84/meg)
64MB SM $ 44 (.69/meg)
32MB SM $ 24 (.75/meg)

If 64MB SM ever breaks the $35 range I will definitely pick up a piece for my Rio500 .

That's great! Especially the 128MB CompactFlash! Ok, time to order the CF Memplug and the 128 MB card. By the way, I forgot to mention in my previous post that in almost every case, the winning price for CompactFlash was on SanDisk cards. I am not familiar with the company one way or another. Do they have a reputation for good products? Are their products any slower than the competition? Keep posting!

Swiftshadow

Posted by Vinny on 06-03-2001 04:38 AM:

All these cards were not as high brand-name recognition. I believe most were "Mr. Flash" brand. I am not sure how well they work. I have used Memorex CF and offbrand CF and can't tell a difference when transferring files though. YMMV. So, these are probably generic for most.

__________________
-Vincent

Posted by Swiftshadow on 06-03-2001 07:30 AM:

Ordered CF card

Well wish me luck. I just put an order in for that Mr. Flash 128 Meg Compact Flash card. Since it was so inexpensive, I also ordered a USB Compact Flash and Smartmedia Card Reader. I'll let you know how well it works once I get my CF Memplug

Take care
Swiftshadow

Posted by hxh167 on 06-03-2001 08:00 AM:

Someone has posted his results in flashadapter forum. It sounds he has a good start but nothing about battery consuming level. The information showed the card is a Hitachi card.

Hsin

Posted by gbgood on 06-03-2001 02:46 PM:

re: newegg.com & off-brand

I ordered the 64mb smc from newegg.com at the same time as my memplug. It came in 3 days. Then I had to keep track of it for 6 weeks, while waiting for the memplug.

But when the memplug DID arrive, the Mr. Flash brand worked fine.

I still haven't gotten a straight answer from piDeveloper in my posts or emails: Does piBackup do a 100% FULL restore like the HS backup mod?

I'm leery because there have been a few posts stating otherwise. I have been spoiled by the b/u mod.

So for that reason, I'm going to order the DUAL slot smc/cf reader from costco $32.99/plus $5 sh.
I see this as an immediate neccessity so I can save the smc data to my HD, and still use the b/u mod for the main ram.

__________________
"I cannot live without books." Thomas Jefferson

Posted by adfleisher on 06-03-2001 04:48 PM:

The PiBackup program does a FULL backup of everything in memory. I found no difference between a backup done with Backupbuddy, HS Backup mod, and PiBackup.

Back to the main topic, I just purchased an additional 32MB SanDisk SM card, and it works great with the MemPlug. The original card i used with the MemPlug during the Beta testing of the module several months ago was a Lexar, and it also worked without any problems. I haven't tried the Viking or any other card yet, but my assumption is that any 3.3v card truly will work without any problems in the module.

The prices for SanDisk cards at Fry's Electronics (the cheapest place to buy direct in the Portland area) are:

8MB - $19.95
16MB - $19.95
32MB - $29.95
64MB - $49.95

Hope that helps.

Drew

__________________
"Whoever said bigger isn't better...Lied!"

Posted by gbgood on 06-03-2001 04:57 PM:

Thanks Drew,
for the answer on pibackup doing a FULL restore.

__________________
"I cannot live without books." Thomas Jefferson

Posted by enhanceyourlife on 06-03-2001 05:15 PM:

Yup, I can verify that PiBackup does a complete backup. As good as BackupBuddy.

One of the major factors that made me go to the SM solution vs. CF was that apparently different manufactures of CF cards may or may not work with the adaptors out there. All SM cards will work with the MemPlug.

Another thing was (at the time) there was no "true" Springboard for CF cards. What I consider a "true" springboard is having the apps loaded in the onboard flash of the module rather than having to load them into the Visor's memory.

__________________
<div align="left">Mike
<hr width="200">
Programming is the struggle between programmers building bigger and better idiot proof systems and the universe building bigger and better idiots
<hr width="200">
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Posted by gbgood on 06-03-2001 06:21 PM:

Sigh.......

thanks again, I feel so much better about piBackup now.

My first memplug insert/hotsync caused a GIANT hard reset, on it's own mind you!
There was a hack conflict, I think.
Anyway, my HS b/u mod was 2 working days old, alot for me. It hurt.
Then there were the few posts saying piBackup had issues (w/ultra money and eyemodule pics, I believe.)

But now, with Mike and Drew saying it's OK. I'm a believer.

New technology requires personal flexibility, I'm ok with that. I just like to be aware and not make too many irreversible mistakes in my life.

__________________
"I cannot live without books." Thomas Jefferson

Posted by enhanceyourlife on 06-03-2001 07:01 PM:

I know it works because as I was reading your message, my Plat was whining it needed batteries, so I changed them and got a blank screen. Then the Palm logo was flashing real fast so I hit the power button and I got the "Press up arrow for "Y"" message. I couldn't get out of it, so I did the hard reset and restored from PiBackup and all is well.

Is there a "right" way to change batteries? Module in, module out, left hand right hand.... It seems that most times I need to change batteries, something wierd happens..

Posted by dvIceT on 06-03-2001 11:42 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by enhanceyourlife
I know it works because as I was reading your message, my Plat was whining it needed batteries, so I changed them and got a blank screen. Then the Palm logo was flashing real fast so I hit the power button and I got the "Press up arrow for "Y"" message. I couldn't get out of it, so I did the hard reset and restored from PiBackup and all is well.

Is there a "right" way to change batteries? Module in, module out, left hand right hand.... It seems that most times I need to change batteries, something wierd happens..

I hate to be such a shill for any particular product, but if battery changes annoy the hell out of you, try out the ICU Accessories recharger kit. You can then charge batteries in situ and not worry about having the "right" procedure for changing batteries, which are run-of-the-mill NiMH's. In addition, you can use it as an AC or DC adapter for extended usage, like when you want to hook your visor up to a GPS.

For the record, my procedure for changing batteries in a PalmOS device is to remove *one* old battery, replace it with a fresh battery, then remove and replace the second old battery. Despite what others have to say about "breaking the circuit," it does seem to make a difference from simply removing both old batteries at the same time.

BTW, you should probably remove any modules prior to a battery change to simplify the visor power up sequence.

Posted by adfleisher on 06-03-2001 11:54 PM:

I know this is continuing an off-topic addition to this thread, but the easiest way to avoid a "hard" reset and data loss when you get the good old blinking logo is to hold the up rocker rather than the power button when you hit the reset pin, then release it. This prevents anything but the OS from loading as a system event on boot. Just a little tip from me to you.

Drew

__________________
"Whoever said bigger isn't better...Lied!"

Posted by Swiftshadow on 06-10-2001 03:12 AM:

Re: Ordered CF card

quote:
Originally posted by Swiftshadow
Well wish me luck. I just put an order in for that Mr. Flash 128 Meg Compact Flash card. Since it was so inexpensive, I also ordered a USB Compact Flash and Smartmedia Card Reader. I'll let you know how well it works once I get my CF Memplug

Take care
Swiftshadow

Ok people, I just received my Mr. Flash 128 CompactFlash card along with DANE-ELEC CF/SM Combo USB Reader. The product arrived in perfect shape. While waiting for the MemPlug CF adapter to arrive, I decided to do a little test. I copied a directory containing 76,531,960 bytes. This directory was made up of fairly large files (smallest was 907K, the largest was 28,865K.) The entire thing copied in 204 seconds! That's a write speed of 375,156 bytes per second! And reading appears to be even faster. Now I just need to cross my fingers and hope this card is compatible with MemPlug CF. I'll let you know what I find.

Take care,
Swiftshadow

Posted by bblue on 06-10-2001 04:09 AM:

I was just about to post something like this.

I own a RIO 500, and will soon get a Memplug.

I went to CompUSA, and I payed $24.00 (tax included) for a 32 MB SM Card! That rocks! Considering 16 Meg card was $20.00 !!! (Media card prices here are ridiculous & inconsistent!)

Both were by Lexar (it that a well-known brand?), and came with a 5 year warranty! Not to mention, iTunes (OSX) and my Rio 500 had NO TROUBLE recognizing the card! Why can't everything be like this??? Transfers were nice & quick! (just under 2 seconds for a 5.5 meg Mp3 file. This was limited by my Rio's processing power mind you)

Overall, I really think that aside from memory limitations (although 128 MB isn't bad!) , SmartMedia cards are the way to go. They're as small as I would EVER want to go, yet despite they're size, they're cheaper than CF in all sizes here. (The SanDisk 32 MB CF card was $34.00! Yikes!) But than again, I saw two SM cards right next to eachother (One by Simple Technology, one by Sandisk) , both 64mb. One cost $20.00 more than the next!

Plus, I can use it for computer storage, Visor storage, and Rio Storage! Could life get any sweeter?

__________________
"Sorry about the whole thing about losing your life savings, but that Palmpilot is property of Enron, so please give it back"

Posted by Anomaly on 06-11-2001 05:25 PM:

FYI - Sandisk has a $35 rebate on the 128mb CF when bought at Amazon.

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