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Universal Health Coverage: Side-by-Side


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Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by yardie
Did my circumstances change because of my efforts or was it just pure luck?

Unless you won the lottery with a ticket you found on the side of the road, it must have been due to someone's efforts.

quote:
If I was still in my home country, it is highly unlikely that I would be able to afford a computer or Treo.

And it seems to me that you (or someone else on your behalf) made a choice for you to move to a country where it was more likely to happen.

quote:
The odds are that I would still be going to bed hungry. While poor folks can move from a poor country to a rich country for a better life, poor folks that are already in rich countries have no where to go.

They could go to the welfare or unemployment office.

Much like people who _want_ to volunteer will find a way to do it, people who _want_ to work will find a job. It won't necessarily be the best job, but even in 'the worst economy since the Great Depression', our unemployment rate is ridiculously low.

05-31-2003 11:10 PM

MIKE STH
Member

Registered: Feb 2000
Location: Moved to Clie Land
Posts: 331

A family making 20k has no business getting a 250k loan

quote:
Originally posted by yardie
A family making 20K a year will never get a quarter million mortgage from the bank -- now matter how much they try and fail.

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06-01-2003 03:08 PM

BobbyMike
Member

Registered: Dec 1999
Location: "Children are a gift from God, they are a reward"
Posts: 1049

quote:
Originally posted by yardie
Againm your view of things are jaded. While I am all for trying again and again, the reality is that not everyone will "make it". In fact, as I argued earlier, most will not. A family making 20K a year will never get a quarter million mortgage from the bank -- now matter how much they try and fail.

Actually his view is not jaded, as his holds out for a hopeful ending as opposed to your version of "only a few ever make it".

Main Entry: 2jade
Function: verb
Inflected Form(s): jad�ed; jad�ing
Date: 1598
transitive senses
1 a : to wear out by overwork or abuse b : to tire or dull through repetition or excess
2 obsolete : to make ridiculous
intransitive senses : to become weary or dulled

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06-01-2003 07:22 PM

BobbyMike
Member

Registered: Dec 1999
Location: "Children are a gift from God, they are a reward"
Posts: 1049

quote:
Originally posted by yardie
Well I am all for teaching people how to fix. I would not like my tax dollars being spent on someone that stays at home and watch soap opera every day. However, I do not mind my tax dollar being spent on someone who genuinely needs a helping hand. You are saying that everyone should be responsible for their own well being... This would mean no state welfare at all, and no support for citizens in dire straits.

I think where this arguement/debate is coming to a difference is who defines help. I don't think you could find anyone not willing to help those in need, but where we seem to differ is how do you go about doing it. It has been well proven by the failure of the present system that throwing more money at the problem doesn't make it (poverty) go away. Poverty is not an actual function of how much money you have coming in, but in how you use it. That's why so many lottery winners end up dead broke in a few years - unwise deployment of their winnings.

A hand out is different from a helping hand. The present system rewards lying, laziness and apathy. The system is run by civil servants who have forgot what the term "civil servant" means. The same amount of money (or less) could be used more effectively in other ways.

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"I am a debtor both to Greeks and to Barbarians, both to the wise and to the foolish."

06-01-2003 07:31 PM

BobbyMike
Member

Registered: Dec 1999
Location: "Children are a gift from God, they are a reward"
Posts: 1049

quote:
Originally posted by yardie
Did my circumstances change because of my efforts or was it just pure luck? If I was still in my home country, it is highly unlikely that I would be able to afford a computer or Treo. The odds are that I would still be going to bed hungry. While poor folks can move from a poor country to a rich country for a better life, poor folks that are already in rich countries have no where to go.

There is no such thing as luck, only odds.

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"I am a debtor both to Greeks and to Barbarians, both to the wise and to the foolish."

06-01-2003 07:31 PM

BobbyMike
Member

Registered: Dec 1999
Location: "Children are a gift from God, they are a reward"
Posts: 1049

quote:
Originally posted by yardie
Did my circumstances change because of my efforts or was it just pure luck? If I was still in my home country, it is highly unlikely that I would be able to afford a computer or Treo. The odds are that I would still be going to bed hungry. While poor folks can move from a poor country to a rich country for a better life, poor folks that are already in rich countries have no where to go.

There is no such thing as luck, only odds.

__________________
"I am a debtor both to Greeks and to Barbarians, both to the wise and to the foolish."

06-01-2003 07:36 PM

Yorick
Member

Registered: Mar 2001
Location: Out of my skull, back in five minutes
Posts: 1435

quote:
Originally posted by BobbyMike

There is no such thing as luck, only odds.

That's odd.

06-01-2003 11:07 PM

ToolkiT
VisorCentral Staff

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 1883

quote:
Originally posted by Yorick

That's odd.

Just my luck

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06-02-2003 02:23 AM

K. Cannon
Member

Registered: Aug 2000
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 1062

quote:
Originally posted by yardie
If I was still in my home country

I hate to show my ignorance/forgetfulness, but where is your home country, yardie?

06-02-2003 01:54 PM

ToolkiT
VisorCentral Staff

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 1883

quote:
Originally posted by K. Cannon

I hate to show my ignorance/forgetfulness, but where is your home country, yardie?

I'm not sure he ever told us... I too dont know/cant remember..

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06-03-2003 12:39 AM

BobbyMike
Member

Registered: Dec 1999
Location: "Children are a gift from God, they are a reward"
Posts: 1049

Canada? (I'm guessing)

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"I am a debtor both to Greeks and to Barbarians, both to the wise and to the foolish."

06-03-2003 03:11 AM

clulup
Member

Registered: Jan 2003
Location:
Posts: 191

quote:
Originally posted by BobbyMike
Canada? (I'm guessing)

I would have said he lives in Canada now, but his home country is somewhere else.... very mysterious story.

06-03-2003 09:20 AM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

If his nick is indicative of anything, the Led Zep song D'yer Maker should be a hint.

06-03-2003 11:47 AM

K. Cannon
Member

Registered: Aug 2000
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 1062

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
If his nick is indicative of anything, the Led Zep song D'yer Maker should be a hint.

Dagnabbit, you enigmatic Toby. now i've got to do yet another Toby-inspired Google search.

Led Zepplin fan I'm not, although I thought I caught a Rush reference by you recently...could be wrong though.
Ask me about Wang Chung or Bananarama, though.

06-03-2003 06:03 PM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by K. Cannon
Dagnabbit, you enigmatic Toby. now i've got to do yet another Toby-inspired Google search.

Maybe Google should start paying me royalties.

quote:
Led Zepplin fan I'm not, although I thought I caught a Rush reference by you recently...could be wrong though.

Yeah, I think I quoted Free Will in a response recently.

quote:
Ask me about Wang Chung or Bananarama, though.

*shudder* No thanks. FWIW, the Zep tune is part of an old joke across the pond. One fella says his wife went on vacation recently. Other fella says "Jamaica?" 1 First fella says, "Course not, she went of her own accord."

1Joke being that 'Jamaica' can sound a lot like 'Did you make her?' if spoken in a certain accent and mashed together (like 'D'yer maker'). Further given the Jamaica hint, it should be obvious the Zep tune in question even if one doesn't know the name of the tune. "oh oh oh oh oh oh oh"

06-03-2003 06:18 PM

K. Cannon
Member

Registered: Aug 2000
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 1062

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
Joke being that 'Jamaica' can sound a lot like 'Did you make her?' if spoken in a certain accent and mashed together (like 'D'yer maker').

Many of the sites I found said it was a sexual reference meaning "Did you make her?" as in "did you have sex?" (Not as in did you make her have sex....)

Anyway, got the reference now...I went off on a confused tangent thinking maybe you meant The Yardbirds...but I see that was not the case.

I'll be petitioning Google on your behalf soon!!

06-03-2003 06:22 PM

MarkEagle
VisorCentral Staff

Registered: Dec 1999
Location: Connecticut USA
Posts: 2682

quote:
Originally posted by K. Cannon
Dagnabbit, you enigmatic Toby.

I'm beginning to wonder if there's anything he DOESN'T know something about!!! Or else, he's a Google wizard!

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God bless America, my home sweet home...

06-04-2003 02:14 AM

Toby
Member

Registered: Jul 2000
Location:
Posts: 3034

quote:
Originally posted by MarkEagle
I'm beginning to wonder if there's anything he DOESN'T know something about!!! Or else, he's a Google wizard!

I know a little about a whole lot of things (there are only two people I've ever met willing to play more than one game of Trivial Pursuit with me

), a lot about some things, and Google certainly does help to fill in the gaps sometimes. And even though I'm taking quite a bit off lately, I'll always be a well-rounded individual.

06-04-2003 02:35 AM

ToolkiT
VisorCentral Staff

Registered: Sep 1999
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 1883

quote:
Originally posted by Toby
I know a little about a whole lot of things (there are only two people I've ever met willing to play more than one game of Trivial Pursuit with me ), a lot about some things, and Google certainly does help to fill in the gaps sometimes. And even though I'm taking quite a bit off lately, I'll always be a well-rounded individual.

Mmm that sounds way too familiar.. some of my friends have accused of me cheating with trivial pursuit (by prereading the cards..)

And when my wife askes me something and I say I dont know anything about that she says: nothing? you are supposed to know something about everything...
btw I'm working hard in the gym to become less 'well-rounded'

Toby, whenever you are in the area I'll take you on for a round of TP...

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06-04-2003 02:44 AM